The Youngest Winemaker in Brooklyn Joseph Zakon

Hey guys, welcome to the 30th edition. I think it's the 30 Clappy. >> I think it's 30 >> of the Clappy and Frank show. We have the great honor of having my first CPG mentor. Um, was it three or four years ago? I came over to Yas and I said, "I'm making this grape juice and salsa drink and you know Kadm the the big monopolists in the in the food kosher food world." I mean that time and that was said, "Let me get a friend who works with Royal Wine." So I know that and will be my mentor and the great Yasi Zecon happily led me in my early journey in CPG. He was my first tasters and he is the I think the first CPG which means consumer package goods founder in the kabala community right currently I don't know there's very few or none consumer package goods founders in the kabal community that I that >> raskkins fish >> raskkins fish correct so yasi had you start um and if one more if I one more thing I remember as a kid the first time I saw A fancy bottle of kosher wine was the Musketine. I think it was black label, right? Used to be black. >> No, but if that's the first time you saw a fancy label, you're very young. >> Wasn't black, wasn't it? Dark. Now it's like pink and white. What was your first label? What color was it? >> Same thing. The original musketini was a little more ornate, but it was >> wasn't dark. >> It was a white. Yeah, I know. This has been forever. >> I'm getting old. Yay. How do you start when you know? >> No, you're just very young. I in my head was a black label with gold lettering. I don't know. >> My first memory of Joseph Zecon Winery is I was in the um Zecon Stationery and Toy Store on Kingston Avenue. Your legendary parents had a beautiful gift shop on Kingston Avenue. I believe your brother-in-law manages the store today. Always a positive experience going there with my children. And your parents were showing off Tangiar and all of us. Your parents were showing off your mother's still alive. There was oh Tangi and your mother should there was an article in the New York Times and they had it framed. It was a it was about Joseph Zon wineries and about an award you won. They were showing it off to everybody. This is in the early 90s. They were so proud that their son's a famous wine maker. >> New York Times. >> New was the New York Times. Do you remember? Do you remember how did you get into the wine business? Back to Mosi. How did you get into the wine business growing up in Crown Heights? Well, it was this very simple uh growing up being a teenager and not really appreciating kosher wine, not understanding the what's so special about it, but yet we make kesh on it and yet it was something that's supposed to serve for you know special occasions and for kings and things and and I'm saying something here just doesn't work. I mean, it was to the point I'm saying, can this wine really become yay if no one likes it? But, you know, it was a teenage question that I had and I said, you know, let me find out and uh what real wine is about. Either the teachers don't were lying to me. It's not true that it's special or we just don't know how to make kosher wine because yeah, in Jewish tradition, in our day-to-day life, wine is the most thing in the world. I was actually at a shar on Shabas Rab was saying that and it's but I think people don't realize if you make hagen in a meal you're not allowed to make shahak on a drink anymore you're shak just the way is all the food now you don't make a bra when you make hagafan you do not make on coffee on water and every wine shabas wine pes is coming up in a few days so you're saying it's the most cherished special item in the world in Judaism and the stuff didn't taste It wasn't. No, no one no one no one enjoyed it. It was like everyone whoever you spoke to would tell you, "Oh boy, we have to drink this." They made kish on it. You know, >> we're talking about like in the 1970s and ' 80s. >> Yeah. >> So you the bottles of wine you would buy in the liquor store, you weren't impressed by. >> No, I genuinely I wouldn't feel good after I drank it. >> But you know, it was like didn't make sense. And then I saw people adding to the Malaga wine, which was full of sugar, even more sugar to to cover the bad days. So I I had no idea what was going on and I knew nothing about wine. You have to understand my father was a teacher. My mother was uh also a teacher and then she was just raising a family and we have no background in business or any anything. >> The little stationary store. When did that happen? >> Much later. >> Gotcha. >> And uh I had no idea about anything. And but I was curious. So one day I said let me find out. And I took uh I took the my mother's blender, bought a some table grapes, stuck it in the blender, mashed it up. It came out a concoction of some compot that was, you know, sweet and bitter because you if you if you grind the seeds, the seeds are very bitter. You're not supposed to grind the seeds. But what did I know? >> And the end it was vinegar. Whatever it is, it is. And it wasn't coming out. It didn't come out. And I said, "Okay, I got to figure figure this out and know how to make wine. I want to know what wine is all about." It was just simply I was just very curious. Why is wine supposedly so and what is what makes it you know how do you make it that it should be appreciated by everyone. >> So how'd you figure it out? >> So I went to the library which is still here the library on Grand Army Plaza. >> Did I ever went there once? >> Okay. >> There's a famous story that went once. I I went there instead of sitting in yeshiva and but you know and I was eight and I was just start reading everything I can on on wine-making that they had there and then the hardest part was that some of the language I couldn't even understand. So I had to sit with a dictionary to understand the words that I'm reading in the in the in the book about wine making. >> Gosh >> and you know then it came to the point of the chemistry behind it. had to learn the tables of the chemistry and all that. So, you know, how carbons and everything work with one another and how that affects the acidity of the wine and the sugars and all the different amino acids and different uh yeasts that give the flavor and create this beautiful bottle of wine. And it was fascinating because I had a hands-on learning experience which is the yeshiva would not give me in anything in life. your parents were were proacted about you going into the wine- making or they thought it was bitter terror. You're not learning enough. I'm just curious what their reaction was. >> Like everyone else in the community, some crazy kid, they have a you know, it is what it is. But I was stubborn and I was and one thing my father told me years ago that I always remembered that if you want to get something done, you will don't have to be perfect at it. You just have to be persistent. So I that was always in the back of my mind that I have to be persistent whether I'll be perfect or not I don't know and as I started you know finding out about these you know about wine making and I started finding out people that were in the industry making con you know connections and talking to people so I got to meet one time we went to this there was a wasn't kosher but it was a con wine convention and I wanted you know I made already a decent wine, a dry wine actually out of California grapes and I couldn't sell it. I'm going on King Stam. People are tasting it and no one likes it. So, but you know the little kid 17 years old has a bottle. It was 18 years old. They gave me three bucks and they took the bottle from me. There was no one no one knew how to drink it. >> $3 a bottle. Where were you producing it? Where were you manufacturing? in my mother's basement, my parents basement and uh it was you know Zinfendel Barbara Ruby Cabernet those were grapes that they were selling in the market for wine making for the Italians or I guess yen whom were making wine also and I followed instructions I had another guy in in Baton Rouge Louisiana's his name was Philip Jackish and he was like my mentor and >> how'd you meet him >> online through mail no online through literally via mail his books and I read his books and send him a letter and we were Yeah. and communicated >> and he would tell me >> and then that was the year that he told me that my Zinfendel tasted like uh hard Gallow Hardy Burgundy. Gallow Hardy Burgundy was then like the top selling wine in America. >> I I went I went to was it Oxnard where they make the wines? >> Yeah. Um, no. Where they have millions of grape vines. I went to be Mashk for a week once in um, where is it? Zerinsk. Where's that area? Fresno. Fresno. Fresno. And Gallo. It was in a gallow. We were doing a kosher grape juice crush for whatever. And there was a gallow. Um, they told me at the time that Gallow, I think, is the biggest wine manufacturer in the world. >> Yeah. >> They landed, the owner landed with us helicopter to take a tour of the factory. I was >> largest privately owned, >> right? Gallow. So od when I wor when I was there I started realizing you see the wines everywhere. So he your mentor told you that your wine tasted like gallow >> gallow's hardy burgundy which was a very popular one. Today it's not I don't think >> that's the biggest compliment in the world. >> Yeah. Especially when you're a kid you don't know what and first of all I don't even know what it tastes like and then that was the funniest thing and then I went and then I found out there was a a wine convention where you for equipment to buy equipment and see different things. >> It came out so good by mistake like what did you what were you doing? No, I was following just reading uh following instructions, you know, like the like you you follow a cookbook. Anyone can make wine. It's something I'm going to come back to and I'll explain. And I I think I say people if you have the patience, you can and you don't mind getting a little dirty, you can make wine, but most women don't want you making wine in the kitchen. So, but uh no, but let me tell you where where where this led to. So this led to another uh to a convention of wine equipment and stuff like that which was in Pennsylvania and I think it was Lancaster and I was went there. I went there just to see what's what what's around you know if I want to make wine you know know which what equipment I need to make wine and uh I meet a guy his name was Leon Adams. Leon Adams was the we'd call like the f the the the father of American wine industry. Yeah. his books are and I don't even think you can find them anymore but he had books and I remember him speaking and saying the day wine will be as cheap as milk is when wine will become popular in America people were not drinking wine those those years yet it's only in the last uh the ' 90s the that people started drinking wine until then we were two we were literally one of the smallest uh per capita countries of drinking wine Trader Joe's was built on cheap wine >> and yeah when the Trader Joe's open, >> right? >> I'm just saying. But this is I'm talking the >> that was their whole >> this is this is 1980s. >> I think I had a$2 or $5 bottle of wine. How >> this is literally I started my first wine I made I think was 1977 >> and 70 and it was a whatever and then 78 was the wine that I made that I couldn't sell. no one, you know, didn't like him. It was like a hearty burgundy and and but then I met him. It was 19 was probably 1980 I met him and when I heard that I said, you know, he has he has a he's saying something that maybe it's true. There is a value to wine that I don't grasp and I'm not a businessman. So it was for me is like, oh, that's a language I understand. You know, businessman right away is how much can I charge? And to me, no, I didn't know that. That's how it works. So yeah, and it's it stuck with me forever. And then and then as I was then I decided I'm going to make uh some wine to sell legally because legally you can't make wine at home and sell it. So when I went on King Sammy was basically I gave it to friends. It wasn't, you know, legally selling official. >> Mhm. And uh then I so from there we went I went and decided we need to get a I need to get a winery license to be able to make wine. And in those days this was before 911. I can tell you the government was the nicest people to talk to. >> Really? >> I this is this is not this isn't this is unreal. >> Took me 40 years to hear this. >> It's I still don't believe this is what happened. I called them up. They send down an inspector. The inspector comes down to my house. He says, he looks at everything, it's not going to work. You cannot we cannot give you a winery license in your own house. You need a separate space. Fanny came down to tell me, >> wow. >> You know, after looking at all the forms tells me, find your own another space and um you know, we'll we're going to help you. If it wasn't your legal residence, if it was your uncle or or a friend, then it would be maybe legal or >> No, it was more like the they just didn't want it, right? They didn't if it's in the house, you have to make separate entrance more than anything else. >> Completely separate entrance. >> That was the criteria. And then he comes back a second time when So I went I I saved up some money. >> Have the similar rules. They want you to have a separate commercial space. >> There is Yeah, there is a reality that's okay. And then I uh then he whatever I rented a space and I was able to uh get a winery license and to get it he came down a second time and and same same inspector and he looked and he said sure no problem you know what you're doing. He tested me on if I know how to analyze the wines and make sure you know that the alcohol is proper. >> Oh so you got you got a location now? >> Yeah I had a location where Empire Kosher is right now. >> What was there then? There was a Chinese restaurant was there were compartments was associated and then there was a Chinese restaurant >> a retail level not on the top >> right right on the right there >> cuz on top I think used to be a roller skating rink bowling alley you was no roller skating upstairs it was it was if anything got no no roll >> movie theater go upstairs >> the roller skating was on Bedford in that >> I think it was a a nightclub maybe or something crazy >> it was yeah it was more like a theater and then maybe a nightclub If you get to sneak into that. >> Yeah. But no, that was that was all gone and then the upstairs was nothing. And >> so you're 18 years old and you took out a commercial lease on our storefront. >> Yeah. >> Where'd you get the money? >> So I worked in the Navy and the Navy hired me to make sure to know where all their boats are at a certain time and during peace peace time, no wars. And >> you left your worked for the army. >> I didn't leave. I it was only part-time. I was still >> You used to work for the Navy? the US Navy. >> Yeah, they were right here in >> They ever worked in the Navyyard and Yasi Zhan worked for the Navy at 18 years old. Where' they recruit you? I never heard this. >> I had I don't know how either because trust me, they were it was like that I even got the job because my credentials did not qualify for the job. >> Montgomery Street boy from worked for the US Navy at 18. What were you doing? >> I was I was a statistician basically. I was basically counting the money that was being spent on each boat wherever they were located and if they you know because they each boat has like their own commissaries and all that and they need to create a profit. >> There's 300 million people in America. >> Not not one of them created a pro. Not one of them had a >> million people in America. Where'd they find you? >> He gets around this guy. >> My my cousin actually who was working in then in programming in computer programming. So she told she she told me this. They they might you might be able to get a job. Just come down. >> Come down where? >> To where she was working. >> She was doing her It was here in Brooklyn. It was in >> the Navy Yard. >> No, it wasn't the Navyyard. It was in Sunset. >> Sunset Park. >> Yeah. You Now there's these commercial buildings. But >> by the way, to be >> This was the first fancy label I saw on a bottle of wine. I was so used to the Kedm like little arching. I don't know was like how many SKs did Kadam have at that time 10 20 cream malaga and I don't know what then suddenly one day I see this fancy label on a bottle of wine I was probably what how old how old is this label Yazi >> I know it's going back a while this 30 years probably 30 years >> this was the first one that we made with the Musketini the first Musketini was actually had the Kesser label >> which was a very ornate >> beautiful label and then we switched over to Joseph >> with all that gold it looks very it looks trumpy it looks bottles. And then we started buying this in our house every week. This was like the fancy bottle. What was it? Eight bucks. >> You don't remember? >> Eight bucks 30 years ago. Probably like >> I don't even know what it sells for today. First years ago >> innovative label I've ever seen in kosher wine as as a kid. So for me, Yassi Zan represents innovation ahead of his time. That's him. >> So again, you went from a basement to a commercial storefront. >> I went to commercial storefronts. I saved up some money. That's how I saved money. It was a part-time job and I saved up some money. I rented a storefront on it was a used to be a Chinese restaurant. It was next to associated where Empire Kosher is now. And the guy cames down to give me the to to check it out and you know they they have to see what they're giving a license on the premises and everything everything adds up. Then later I find out he tells me I went to 770. That's how how close they were. you were able to talk to them to find out that I had nothing to do with the mafia. It was no mafia money involved and you know that I was a legitimate person and you know but >> 18year-old >> whatever. Yeah. But I'm just saying how you were able to talk to them. >> Wasn't what was the legal drinking age then? >> 18. >> It wasn't 21 yet. So funny. >> It was >> by the way you could be a bartender at 18. You could serve it but you can't drink it. And no, the funny part was that I what's not funny. What was so amazing and I said, "Wow, this is our government." Because this was the first time I'm having a real interaction with governments and it's it's so they're so nice. They tell me what to do. They they explain it to me. I have a question. They answer the phone and you know like I need to get a bond and they told me just don't go buy don't pay an insurance company for a bond. Take a you know it wasn't that wasn't much. He says take your savings and buy a $1,000 bond with clip coupons. We're going to use that as a bond for you and we're going to send you your clippings every every every six months. >> Excuse my ignorance and maybe other people watching the show. What bonds for? What? I don't know what >> a winery has to be bonded. Meaning that if god forbid you're going to steal the tax money that you owe them, they have your money. So usually you pay an insurance company and big companies that's that's the norm. >> How many money? I mean I have now I don't now now now I have bonds for my winery and but then they were like so nice and so he tells me no just you know give me the bond and then every six months you and then it was Carter error 14% interest so I would get from the bond for every six months a check of 14% it was like unreal >> they made life easy for you governor >> exactly they wanted to help you >> Wow your first account >> my first account. Who who remembers? I had Burough Park and Eber. >> So again, you're now you're an 18-year-old. You have a commercial license from the government. You're bonded. You have a winery distribution. You have now a storefront. Now you have bills. Now you got to buy buy grapes. You have to buy machinery. You're buying at these conventions. You have to pay taxes. You have you're the only worker. You're you're entrepreneur, soul provider. >> Entrepreneur. >> How does it work? >> You delivered yourself. >> Yeah. >> So what were you calling yourself? >> It was just me. Um, nothing. >> What the label say? >> Kesser. >> Okay. Only >> Kesser. How'd you come up with the name? >> I don't know. I just thought it was a cute very good very a proone name for a community of ours. >> You see everybody in everybody just talk about Kesser being some high level. You're like, I'm high level wine Kesser. So again, the guy at the show told you that one of your wines was as good as the gallery, the trillion dollar company. Gallow, the trillion dollar company. >> So you took notes of what you did, right? And >> I always kept notes. I have to constantly write down what I'm doing. If not, if you don't have notes, you're not going to get a winery license. You have to have records. You have to keep records of everything that's going on and how you're doing it and what you're doing. So, that's the norm. And that was it. Basically, was as another side note, I just want to say is that by me starting this company, which was in 1981, I was the youngest person in the United States to have a bonded winery. >> Wow. And I helped two laborators go into the wine business. One was Yasi Bist in Florida. He started a distribution company and started selling the selling wine. And the other one was uh Nakas in Detroit. Isl >> Yeah. He was selling chemicals and all of a sudden he's became a a wine distributor. >> Yeah. So it was like you know that was really nice. >> And didn't also Mr. Suker invent or start a joy in Bartinura. >> I have no idea. >> No comment on that. Okay. >> He he worked for Kadam and I don't know what more than that. >> Okay. >> And uh >> so you got media attention that you're the youngest bonded winery in America, >> right? And you know people like really were curious and everything about it. And >> how many kosher wine stores were there in New York, New Jersey when you started? >> I don't know. I just whatever I I whatever I made sold out. I didn't even have a chance to. >> But how many stores? There were tents. Let's just give people a start. >> Oh, kosher stores. >> Kosher wine stores. >> Bar Park had three, I think. That's what I remember. Flatbush had maybe one or two. >> Grown Heights. >> It was only ever. >> That's it. >> Yeah. >> And the Gisha stores carried your stuff or No. >> Did the grocery stores buy from you? >> No, I didn't get to it. But the point was that when I got my license, I signed I went and I made a the first ever commercial labeled kosher Chardonnay. >> Wow. >> From Long Island Grapes. And it was an unbelievable bottle of wine that I made. And uh I couldn't sell a single bottle to the kosher consumer either. And when the non-Jews found out about it and they sent me to the River Cafe, which is the famous restaurant under the Brooklyn Bridge >> in Denver, >> there was a guy there named Joe Delisio. He tastes it and he tells me, "You never tasted Chardonnay in your life and you made this wine." So I tell him, "If you believe me, yeah, I never did." I'm like, "I don't even, you know, I just follow the instructions and I made this wine." Okay, I'm buying everything you made. everything. >> Wow. >> And he made me sign the bottles >> under Ker label. >> Yeah. He put it right away. It was on his >> menu >> and that was you know but I was in a quagmire here. What was the problem? Where my from one side I don't really know the goes world of wine making and yet I have the Jewish world who doesn't appreciate it. >> We need to make something good for them. >> Remember creag nasty stuff. So I was so what I what what made me realize is that we have to make low alcohol sweet wine. So the Kesser Concord that I made was only 7% alcohol and that changed the whole taste profile of the wine where people really appreciated it and they loved it and that I couldn't I just couldn't keep up with and then came along the big boys and copied it and tried to put me out of business. But that's you know that's happens when you when other people are in business too. I've never tried to put anyone out of business. That's one thing I can tell you. And what what else happened along the way is that Yardan Winery who is the then is today is the Rolls-Royce of kosher wine in my opinion just started out and there was a guy named Peter Stern. He wasn't Jewish who was their consultant and helping them build up that winery. And I got to know him also. Somehow I got to know people that were really involved in the industry. yard is Israeli one. Right. >> Right. And they were just they just started in also in the 1980s, early 1980s and uh they were building the their winery and everything and they didn't know how to go about with the kosher end of it that it would be accepted in the United States and be accepted in Israel. So the owner then was Shimshin Welner and he had a there was also from Barcan Winery the owner Boxer. They both trying to figure out what should they do to get kosher. They come to my house, me, the kid, the 20-year-old kid, and I'm telling them, well, I just got the okay to give me a cuz those are labaves that I know. Those are my friends. It's the first time okay ever got a a ha on their wine. So, they got the okay from me and then I directed them to get the okay from Rabbi Levy and the rest is history. Because of them, Rab Levi got all these other Israeli wineries who will, you know, use okay for their wine. >> So they wanted an Americanized recognized. >> So that's to me was something to say like, wow, you know, I can help a fellow labra. I'm that's what I love. That's my job in life. Not, you know, nothing more, nothing less. >> They didn't have from Israel like bad. Why they >> right? But they didn't >> American market. >> Yeah. They were the American market. Badats. You was they they didn't know. They literally they were clueless. >> I always tell people when they're opening up a story, I always say get the okay. I'm not getting paid to say this. I say get the okay. I said because the world respects it. The modern Orthodox world respects it. And >> whoever doesn't respect it doesn't respect someone else. So you think you know which >> it's a very it's a very safeure. >> It's a like you know it's it doesn't it's goes it goes without an end. You know who's to respect. This is our family. This is who you >> So from the day you opened you had the okay. >> Yeah. >> Yes. But I see just for people in the food business if they're going to have to pick a what would you advise them? I see you have three. You have okay chk and hill wineburger if someone's coming up with their own product how would you advise them about what should they get? What do they need? What do they not need? If you're starting today which >> I don't go there it's the rabb that's between them and the rabb. >> No from a business perspective not spiritual. >> From a business rather just tell them what I use. You saying they should get a in in the kosher world there's something called the national and aer so okay is considered a national >> oh you went through all this you know all about it >> I want you to discuss talk about it >> that I don't want to discuss it it's something I don't want to know oh absolutely not >> I think the okay has a certain >> I'm just saying why I'm just saying the okay because this is our labature for people so I'm talking about our own >> hill of wineburgger's mount kiscoco that's like herzog in-house house. >> No, he's big. No, he runs his Octagus. He'll have M is the head of his Sakus. >> Oh, CRC >> and he has his own private brand. >> Yeah. >> Interesting. Okay. >> Yeah. Which is also Yeah. >> So he competes with himself. >> I don't know. I don't understand the politics. I don't want to know. >> You don't want to get But in general in the kosher world, people get a especially the target in the world, they get a ha and a national when they go to buy her from Costco, they see okay ou that's all they know. I just want to make a confession that my whole life I said when I get older I'm going to start appreciating good dry wines and I'm almost 40 and I'm still having a hard I'm still having a hard time appreciating good dry wine regardless of the brand. I tried the holding my nose and going like this and smelling it and looking at it and letting it gargle for a half a minute. I've tried everything. I go to very wealthy people's homes and they say, "Izzy, I have this wine. I have this scotch. I have this. What could I get you?" I said, "Could you please bring me a freezing cold diet Dr. Pepper? And if you don't have that, a cold diet coke, cuz you're $600 bottle of wine and a fancy bach that you have to crack open with a screwdriver." I said, "I just prefer the diet Dr. Pepper. What could I do to become more sophisticated and really appreciate good wine?" Okay. Number one, you are sophisticated. Number two, to appreciate anything, you have to appreciate who you are. So, it doesn't matter. You like to eat? >> Love eating. >> Okay. Do you like chocolate or you like vanilla? >> I like both. >> You like strawberry or you like mango? >> More of a strawberry than a mango. >> Okay, there you go. So everything in the wine is a food. That's all it is. It's food. It's the way it's made is that it takes Hashem made that if you take a grape and you squeeze it, it will turn into wine on its own. The job is also that it shouldn't spoil. So the wine maker has one job making sure that it doesn't spoil. Now the difference in tastes and flavors and the expense of the wine is where the grapes are grown. If it's grown in Napa Valley where an acre of land cost $50,000 and you're growing only um 100 one ton of grapes on on an acre, this wine is going to be very expensive. So per pound what what does it mark itself per pound? >> So it'll be very expensive. Now will it be very good quality? No. Definitely it's going to have a certain smoothness, a certain taste to it, a certain flavor to it that it will be very unique and different because it's so it's so it is so unique. The per the chef, the cook, whoever made it has turned it this wine, this grapes into a very unique bottle of wine. However, most grapes are not grown like that. Most grapes are grown you get 10 um ton to the acre and they're grown in different areas, not in the area like Napa Valley where the climate and the soil are, you know, in perfect sync. Some grapes are grown in different climates, different soils. New York, for example, is very difficult to grow that type of quality grape. But we have the uniqueness of New York which some people appreciate but a lot fewer than they appreciate the typical California Mediterranean style wines which is Israelis and Italian and French and for for that matter also Argentina and Chile. So they they have they grow that type that those type of grapes and with those type of grapes literally anyone can make wine. When you make dealing with New York State grapes, it requires a lot more work. Usually, you don't get enough sugar in the grapes. The acids are too high and you got to know what you're doing. And it's all experience from what the chef knows how to prod it along. It should come out the way you want it. But to say that there's an inherent value in a bottle of wine that costs $100 compared to a bottle of wine that cost $20, there is and there isn't. If the person likes that wine and he can only get it if he pays $100, then fine. That's the what what it is. But if a person doesn't notice really much of a difference or says the difference in taste between the 12 and 120 is not worth it for me, he's allowed to say that and he should say that. It's the right thing to say. You are the only one who should decide if you like that wine or not. Not because someone is making a lot of noise and saying I bought a $100 bottle of wine and it's amazing wine. That's why you have to like it. >> So what was the most you spent on a bottle of wine? >> It's take for example caviar. If you I mean we don't know the non-coosher caviar. We've never tasted but non-coosher caviar is very expensive. Why is it very expensive? Because it's rare. It's hard to get a Struggen to get that caviar. Kosher caviar is much less. And do you know we don't know the difference in taste if we don't taste it. And people who have taste it say yeah there is a difference in taste. So again there's a certain thing there are certain values in wines inherently if they're grown a certain way come from a certain place where it's very expensive. But it all has to do with what's in the grape. >> But one second. We know in real estate, location, location, location. So the exact contractor could build the exact house on Park Avenue and it'll be $17 million. Or you could build it in Utah and it would cost $1.2 million. So you're paying 16 times more because of the location, but it's the exact same house. >> Even you could even build it in the same area, right? >> Not building the location. >> Okay. So the location. So if a bottle if a certain area is very very very expensive to grow grapes does it >> could it be that the same grape could be grown in a cheap area? >> It could be >> or not necessarily will it taste the same? >> Not no not it will not taste the same but it will be very close. That's the difference. And you know it's like you're saying real estate take for example art. You have a someone painted a beautiful apple and that person for whatever reason people are paying for it a million dollars. A little kid can make the exact same apple. What are they gonna pay for it? >> 50 cents. >> Hold on. You know, >> there we go. >> Yeah. Clap. I just want to give a credit to Yasi who whatever all the art he puts on his bottles of wine, the values go up because they recognize. So when he puts a Z cl on his bottle and handle Liberman and a Nakshan these three artists now people recognize them. >> I never did Z Liberman. >> You did you never did handle Liberman? >> So you just said Nakshon and Climman. >> Yeah. And there is the value people recognize. >> But for example, here let me show you something for Can I move this? >> Yeah, you can move move it by the stick, he said. >> But he also off the record told me that how much did this design cost you? Be honest. >> Oh, this cost me nothing. It was in Pakistan maybe. >> Yeah. $10, right? $20. >> Wasn't that crazy? >> This is camouflage. >> No, from uh >> No, it was $150 in Pakistan. >> Upwork. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> People think I have to go to design firm, spend 10, $20,000. >> Yeah. Then I needed an in-house someone to he wasn't a you can't you can't work with them. Yeah. >> Okay. >> But the the reason I didn't have to spend more money because the >> we had an in-house designer who was able to finish it up. So >> So I understand a little bit to educating the island. The mounted kosher wine that's going to be drunk in the next couple of weeks is going to be probably in the hundreds of millions of bottles because let's say 15 million Jews and non-Jews are celebrating Passover. Everybody buys a few bottles. just that the people could understand the customer could understand when you when you press a grape and it's made out of a single grape not a not a mix almost sounds like a blend but a mix a single grape so there's different grapes like u malag what are the names of the grapes that people I'm just curious >> oh cabernet son is popular and then you have a cabernet frank and you have merllo and you have a petite verdo and you have >> so merllo cabernet sar are all different types of grapes they look different when you look at them there how many variations of grapes are I'm just curious. >> Oh, there's there actually could be thousands. But how many are do we actually use? >> There's the the popular ones, but you know, if you go to Europe, there's so many different ones they have. >> And the grapes you buy in the grocery store are not wine grapes. >> The French hybrids that we grow here in New York State is phenomenal amount. >> But you know, that's you know, >> so just get But she always says to give me three things. Let's go through five quick things about a grape. So there's the actual type of grape. A Merllo grape or a Cabernet grape or a French grape. So then there's the grape. Then there's that exact plant or seedling. You could grow that vine. But if you buil you could grow it in Long Island, let's say, and you could grow it in France or you could grow it in Italy. And based on the nature and the climate and how high on the mountain and what nurtur nutrients are going into the thing soils, it's going to taste different. So exact grape grown in a few different places and it could be very expensive, very expensive real estate or hard intensive labor can make a difference. Now, when it comes to wine being extremely strong, 16 17% versus a 3 or 4% alcohol content level, what's in in 10 seconds of chemistry, what's making a grape wine be 16% versus a 3 or 4%. >> Okay. the grapes generally the wine grapes uh will be growing and collect sugar as they grow and the sugar will grow as the season goes on and they're growing in the sun and the sugar levels will reach around 21 bricks and that's when they're really ripe for making >> 21 bricks in in English >> 21 bricks says 21% sugar >> and >> sugar turns into alcohol so 21% >> it turns sugar now That's the norm here in New York. In California or Israel or any of the warm climates, it'll be anywhere from 24 to 26 to 28 >> percent alcohol. >> Sugar. >> Sugar. Sugar. >> Right now, each 2% of sugar makes 1% alcohol and 1% carbon dioxide. You know the bubbles that you'd see in champagne. The real champagne can be made is the real champagne is by preserving the carbon dioxide from the fermentation of the wine. You could also add CO2 to it like salts and call it, you know, you can't call it champagne and whatever, but it it'll be similar. It won't taste the same. >> You're faking you're faking the process. >> Yeah. Yeah. Right. Whatever. Yeah. It's called artificially carbonated. Or you could do a charmat process where you can take all the wine and put it into a a tank and let it create bubbles. So that's more similar to the regular champagne. And then there's the expensive ones that are made in the bottle itself, which is a very tedious, laborous work. But the point is that the each 2% will give you 1% alcohol. So now if you have 21% sugar, >> but 11% alcohol, >> you end up with 11% alcohol. So you have a dry wine and no more sugar. The sugar is all gone. Right now if you want it to be 7% alcohol, you ferment only how much how how much how much sugar? Figure it out. >> You want 73 and 20 14 >> 14 and the remainder remains sweet in the wine which is what you have when I make the eminent Passover wine. How do I stop the fermentation? Because once it starts fermenting by nature just wants to go go. So originally we do is we filter it to reduce the yeast count. We chill it very we chill it down as much as we can and we ferment it very slowly so that we can control the fermentation to give it a final freeze down that it stops fermenting. And then once we get that done, we again use special sterile filtration to get rid of all the yeasts that are in the bottle that will want to make the sugar ferment. >> So you don't need to use sulfites. >> Huh? >> You don't need to use sulfites. >> You need to you use first of all it's not a question of needing to use sulfites. Sulfites are naturally in the ground. So grapes have sulfites in them. Those sul there are natural sulfites. And no sometime you you need I mean I'm not going to say you don't need sulfites. The sulfites are not so much to stop the fermentation. Sulfates is to stop any bad yeasts or wild yeasts to take a hold. That's where that's why you use sulfites. But it will never sulfites in itself will not stop a fermentation. It will never stop it. >> So sulfites is a chemical, a powder. What is it? >> It's sulfur basically what you see on a match. It's in the ground. It's a sulfur that comes from the ground. >> I know people are allergic to sulfites and could be. >> So we have the grape. We have the grape. what type of grape where it's grown. Then >> region >> the region. Okay. Now you're putting the grape into into it. You crush it. And now based on how you measure the sugar level is and or stopping the sugar level, that's how strong you get the alcohol to be. Okay. Now the color is based on the color of the grape. The natural >> skin, right? >> Right. Right. So most grapes the color comes from the skin. There are some grapes that have in themselves their color within them, but those are not popular wine grapes. And uh >> see this has a beautiful like light tingy color. So it's a lighter grape. And these are much darker grapes. >> Um that has a difference in the taste. The the color is not that's just naturally whatever the grape is. >> It could affect the taste. >> Now how long from when you crush the grape until it's in the store? Because you know aged wine is in the barrel. We're not talking about when they say aged wine is not talking about >> barrel. You mean a bottle, right? >> It can age in a bottle to to make an old like crush of a expensive wine as aging is in the barrel or in the in the bottle. >> Wine ages from the moment you squeeze the grape. >> It's like it's the moment you need your dough and you're making food, >> right? >> Or you're cooking something, it starts aging, right? >> This is 2024. So this is two years old. So this great from when this was crushed, it's over two and a half, two and a half years old. If I drank this in 2024 or I drink it today, we're going to taste it soon. It's going to taste better now or the aging is mostly in the barrel. >> It's at it's at its perfection though. >> I know with scotches and whisies and all these things. It has to do with being like blue label. It's in the barrel 50 years or 30 years. >> Scotches. Yes. >> Scotch is the barrel. Wine is not in the barrel. >> Depends which kind of wines. And and this wine will not age. Now is the time to to drink it. >> Okay. >> Okay. And it's made to be drunk right away. Are there wines that Kesser wines manufacturers that could get better sitting in the bottle on your shelf? >> Yes. So, this is what I'm trying to explain to you. So, you were just holding that other bottle called Nature Screaming. >> The Nature Screaming is Where's the Nature Screaming? >> Nature Screaming. >> Right. So, this >> 2024 as well, >> right? Now, now this wine has no sulfites, but we're not even It's not even being sold as no sulfites wine. It's being sold as a very a very good Cabernet Svenon from Pasarovals because it just happens to taste very good and it has the added benefit that was where that was no sulfites were added and it's people love it for that and it's not mov >> okay so now when it comes to grapes that are gra wines that are are like a blend you you blend multiple multiple different types of grapes. So, you're getting multiple wines in basically the same bottle. What's the When is that recommended preferred? When do you not do that? When do you decide to make a blend? >> When you have a lot of grapes, you don't know what to do with them. It's you it's a very subtle it's like, you know, saying when do we put in this much pepper? When do we put in paprika? When do we put in that? It's it's again to me it's basically a food. You taste you know the the the flavor profile of this wine. You know the flavor profile of that wine. Are they going to enhance one another or they're not going to enhance one another? >> Let me get a little sip. You see? >> I think we I think we're talking so much about the wine. I got to get I gota >> And he said he wants a sweet one. We're going to do the musket. >> I know he wants this. Don't give him the sweet. He >> Well, he wants He says he like d peppers. >> I don't want him to have the sweet. >> Oh, >> I want him to have this. >> Let me see this. What do we have over here? Ker Cabernet Soon. And this is Hold on. One second. This is from >> Beo, New Jersey. This is a New Jersey grape. >> No, it's a New York bottle. >> It's a blend. It's a blend of grapes and >> it's again cabernet so as a blend >> different grapes. >> When you see cabernet so on a on a bottle it's a cabernet grape and a savon grape. >> No, it's just it just could come from different areas. >> So this particular one >> this is a prop priority secret of where these grapes come from. >> This one is a secret >> in general or this one? >> This one. >> Okay, pass it. I'll open. I have the opener. >> Oh, let's get this. Let's get busy over here. By the way, when it comes to cork screws, a dollar corkcrew versus a $200 cork screws, could one of them affect the the cork to make a a taste in the wine or there's no not happening? >> Cork if if you have a bad cork. >> No, cork, not spoil the wine. >> The cork itself, >> the cork, you can sometimes come by a bad cork and it will spoil the wine. Yes. >> I'm finding that some of them don't have the real cork feel. I'm finding that some wines today have like a rubbery fake feel. >> That that shouldn't be done. It should be It should be made out of a real cork. No, because they're afraid of the real corks. They had too many problems with real corks being spoiled. They didn't have a good supplier or something. So, they just solve all the problems by using that >> rubber rubber. And it's cheaper, right? Well, it's cheaper, too, right? >> But it makes the wine look cheaper, also. You don't You don't do any rubber quirks. >> No comment. Not >> No, no, I don't. I do screw caps. >> This is mushial or not mushial? >> This is mushel. >> Mushel. Say, tell me about >> You should give this to the cameraman. >> First of all, you have to go like this. No. Got to go like this. >> Yeah. Can you tell us how to how to drink? >> Did you hear the camera? Is the cameraman here? >> Okay. I went like this. I went like this. Then you're supposed to go like this, right? You go like this. >> The cameraman will show you how >> told me. He told me he became a a dry wine drinker. >> Come on set. >> Yankee come on set. You'll do it later. Okay. No, we can come on set. Yankee. We never had Yankee on set. which >> delicious. This is delicious. >> Look, you see he became now a dry wine. >> Ah, it's good. >> I found that very expensive wine. I can taste a difference. Take this bottle. You take the cup. Yeah, this one. Oh, straight a mug. >> In a coffee mug doesn't taste the same. >> Bring up glasses. Bring another >> Take mine. >> Oh, this is good. How much does this bottle retail for? >> They say it's worth about 30 bucks. >> And you charge? >> I don't. I I can tell you just what the stores are selling it for. I don't charge anything. >> Ah, this sells for 30 in the store. >> No, sells for seven. >> $7? This is $7. >> Yeah, >> you could have told me 100. I'll be like, >> sold out already, so it doesn't matter. >> 12%. >> Now, isn't there a big over supply of grapes these days because of China is not importing? So, is that that means that you get higher quality grapes for cheaper today? >> No. So, one of the reasons I was able to create this bottle for such a valuable price and which is my goal in life is to be able to make decent wine for people who are financially struggling and you know should just be able to buy >> valueriven a good a good bottle of wine and our own labage community especially because every community has wines today and everyone's making wines is the reason why I made that bottle. And uh I was literally because of the downshift in wine consumption the US which is attributed they say to one uh ampic and two people are using marijuana instead of alcohol. So the wines literally alcohol sales wine sales in the in the US is down 40%. >> Wow. >> Since when? The last few years. >> Yeah. the last two years. So >> I think people are more health conscious also. >> Yeah. Welline people is wine healthy >> alcohol. >> So >> younger people are drinking. >> So fortunate for me was that I was able to get some of these grapes that were going into $100 bottles of wine. The farmer just said, you know, I'll give it to you for $500 a ton instead of $3,000 a ton. >> Wow. >> I heard they're tearing down vineyards now. >> They're tearing down. Yeah. All that is happening. So what's going to be next year? I don't know. But for now, I was able to do something good for the community. I did it >> and it's a project right here. >> No, it's a beautiful product. It's a beautiful, beautiful wine. It's a beautiful The label came together. Beautiful. We changed the label, which is really nice. >> Where's the dancing one? I really like that one. >> That's the fangan. I didn't bring that. I forgot to bring that. >> He did. >> That's selling a lot too. >> The package is amazing. You took like >> that's also a lab boy created these this design. Yeah. His name is Munutz. >> Munit. Wow. >> Yeah. He he lives in Boston and he's was Shai's friend and Shai tells me he's my friend. You know, ask him. I said fine. I have no problem. I love to help my own. I don't want to go outside. >> I said you were super helpful when I started my first brand. They're really like the guys that use some pes and they like eat the matzah three tables away from where they eat the meal. I know the real it's a fact they only drink eminent Passover wine. When did this eminent label come in that like the from the real from people drink every bas? >> I don't know. >> Is it the one that you don't add anything or you do something special to it or >> Yeah. Whatever. And it's everyone can make this wine. You know something to me I say if someone who's really conscious of his food on Pesak he has to make his own wine. >> You're taking yourself out of business. >> I'm not worried. I'll help him. >> From squeezing the grape to ready in the bottle. How long does it take? >> Well, it all depends. Some wines can take a >> What's the minimum? If I want to make my wine today, could I have ready for Pesak? >> Yeah. Today? No. >> I can't 40 days or something. >> Exactly. Uh you could but you can let's say buy after pes buying I think if I gra today how long did it take 40 days listen to you said today you can't no there's no 40 days but there are people that are very holy and they don't trust no one so they squeeze out the grapes and they call it must and they say it's it's for pes and it's I don't even think there are drinking arocles >> because >> because it's not wine and it's a it's a period end of discussion >> so how long does it take >> huh >> squeeze is ready to drink. Not in the store. Just if I want to make in my house, what's the shortest amount of time it will take? >> What? To make grape juice? >> To make a wine. >> To make a wine can take 10 days. >> 10 days. >> A week even. Three days. It depends, you know, on your >> Where did I get this idea? Where did I get this idea from? About 40 days. What was the 40 days stuff? >> It's brought down has to be 40 days old before we can be under. It's a 40-day process. I'm going to tell you. No, but yeah, but the re But if you want to make wine and not work so hard, >> go get a Polar Spring plastic bottle, gallon, drink the water and buy. Now, now you might be able to get You have to look up online who's selling it in New Jersey, I believe. Maybe here they have they import fresh grapes from Chile or Argentina. I don't know from where wine grapes buy a case. They're expensive, but you're going to enjoy it. Take each grape off the stem. Put it into the bottle. It's tedious. Fill it up. Fill the grapes up till the top, you know, as much as you can. Don't know, you don't don't overfill it because whatever. Till the top. Put the cap back on. Don't tighten the cap. Just enough for any air when it starts fermenting to escape. And as long as no dirt gets back in inside, the grape on the bottom will from their own gravity and pressure start squeezing, you'll start having juice on the bottom. 40 days later, you're going to have a a wine. The wine is going to be very sweet. There's still a lot of wine in the grapes. But if and it's going to be a light color, even if it's a you're using red grapes, but it's definitely going to be a nice sweet bubbly. It's going to be very bubbly because all the CO the carbon dioxide is still in there. Remember I told you when you ferment the sugar half >> you think even with the cap loose you could get CO2 built up >> so the CO2 should get out but you don't want dirt to go in. >> So you have to seal it how you don't want oxygen to go. >> So how tight do you have to >> you don't tighten it you just seal it enough that >> nothing goes back in as long as the can escape. Otherwise Otherwise the bottle will explode. >> Oh you just put the grapes in and walk away. >> Yeah. And walk away later. >> Yeah. Come back 40 days later. >> A few years ago there was an article. I think it was on CO that your son was in altera eighth grade maybe Lady Rabbi Feldman's classine made a wine experiments and whatever and I was thinking to myself it's so beautiful you know you talk about wine you talk about situs you talk about all these kosha dick things you talk about carbonas all day but kids are not going to farms I thought it was so beautiful that you came down to yes and you made a wine experiment is this how you did it with this Poland spring bottle >> yeah yeah that's what that's what yeah yeah but it was very high in alcohol because the grapes were so high in sugar >> 14y olds were getting high in alcohol It was unbelievable. But they Yeah, it was a fun time. >> And they all came home with what a gallon a gall was a gallon bottle. >> Two bottles or three bottles. >> Bottles of of wine. >> As a CPG guy retail, how do you get that spot in Empire Kosher? That perfect end cap right when you walk in. Do you have what's You have some type of deal. You have that perfect spot always. >> Where where his wine is? >> Empire Grocery. It's the best location in the entire supermarket. >> Well, that's cuz it's Pesak and they all year round. You have that spot right when you walk in. I don't know because people it's a staple that people buy every you know to go sch slle a hand in the head I guess the best ever I think we got a little caught off guard you we were discussing a Chinese you went to a Chinese restaurant you were the you were the guy making it distributing it to stores in bar park how did you become this multi-million dollar mega brand I want to know I I'm still caught up on how this happens >> it's a lot more than that >> it's really >> tell me a little bit about this experience. >> It's something that I met Swilly and I can't get enough of him. >> An old problem. >> Yeah. I met you and I said, "Oh, he bo you can bother me again. He used to bring every new sample to Yasi." >> So what you So the Chinese >> Oh, wait. It's not only him that I love so much. I spent Pesak many years with him and his Rebbitson. as Brettson is an amazing incredible Asus Kyle Sadus incredible personality good person and I got to know his children his sons and uh you have a daughter you have only one daughter >> I have two daughters >> I don't know the others I know Luna >> Luna >> Luna and my wife Connie are besties they're like they're like amazing >> but you know Giza Giza is the youngest >> who's Luna mixing it up >> Luna Luna is the older one and she's married >> that's the one I don't know Giza is the one that's friends with Khani I mixed it up. Yeah, Ga is the one that's friends with Khani. They used to work together. They're they're always on the phone. Whenever I come home, they're on the phone. >> Takes away all my attention. Anyways, >> by the way, I'm wearing Yassi's hat. I have the real wine maker hat. >> I told it. >> It's a farmer's hat. >> I told him where he didn't wear it. He said he wants to look fancy. He's, you know, >> so you from your empire, how'd you get into mass distribution? What would happen in between? >> So, what happened? >> Was it all up from there? I was I was building the brand for 10 years basically >> 81 to 91, >> right? Meanwhile, as I was building this brand, people were finding out about me. The New York Times found, you know, somehow found out who, you know, that I was making wine here in Brooklyn. You understand Brooklyn was a place that no one was excited about. >> Clappy, I remember the West End. What's it say? >> West End of Long Island. >> Write a label. He stopped. I don't know why >> because if we put Brooklyn, it was like, you know, he had no no stopped writing it. You know, they'd run away. >> Yeah, you're right. Everything is a Brooklyn. >> You stopped writing West End Long Island. >> No, it's there somewhere on the label. >> People used to love like Chapoo, the Westing made it sound Long Island was now Brooklyn Long Island. So Brooklyn is very trendy and cool today. Today those days it was like, "Oh my gosh." And then so whatever. So this guy's name is Frank Pryal, Irishman, a really nice guy. And he came, he said, you know, I would like to do an interview next taste the wine. So he comes I'm I'm in my comes to my my mother comes to our house my mother she made him a lunch you know and it was like what you know what do we know you know we were real typical Jewish fa family that have never been involved in in the limelight of society in that sense and uh and he enjoyed he's tasting everything he's enjoyed it and then then he told me something then that was also gave me a lot of kay and saying continue says people don't realize anyone can take grapes and turn it into wine follow instructions and make wine but there are certain people who have a art in making wine and their wine is just that tiny difference and he says you have it in you and when he said that to me he like my ego flew through the roof >> New York Times >> yeah and he you know and he published it and you know and he wrote it and it was like oh my gosh And I didn't believe even, you know, that I'm going to get a front page New York Times article. >> Front page. >> Yeah. 1986. 86. >> Oh, the Metro edition or the National? >> Oh, was the whatever the food I don't know how it was. Food and wine. Huge. Huge. I was born in '86. It was crazy. A long time ago. >> Good day to you. >> And yeah. No, it was like really amazing. And I think it made a lot of made a big kish hashem and the reports were coming because in those days there was like no social media like you nothing >> all the papers >> people so people sitting so I'm getting a report and someone's calling me where this guy I'm flying to Egypt and I'm reading the New York Times. Who the hell are you? You know because and he got flack for it also from a lot of the people who had their noses up in the wine industry. Why are you wasting your time with this guy? >> This 20some year old kid. >> But he he was such a sweet man. Such a a straight honest man. >> Did sales skyrocket? >> It was Yeah, it was crazy. It was like I didn't know, you know, how to go about it because I'm not a businessman. So, I literally didn't know where to go from there. And uh and then CNN came. >> Wow. >> And they did a whole story on me. >> Wow. So, you know, and it was the early days of CNN when no one saw them as a bad uh station and it was Yeah, it was just quiet quite fascinating. I had I had v a grape vine growing in the backyard and they were fascinated about the grape vine that was growing >> in Brooklyn. >> Yeah, >> you could grow grapes in Brooklyn >> for sure. >> I if if I if I would ever have an opportunity to grow grapes in Brooklyn, I probably can grow one of the best quality grapes in Brooklyn. We have a microclimate in Brooklyn for grape growing. You do it on a rooftop. All these rooftops you don't >> What happened? What happens in the winter to the vine? >> You need ground. >> What happens to the vine in the winter when it's 20 below zero here? >> So this is a this year was a once in a doesn't happen often. And if you grow them properly, Brooklyn can survive. >> Wow. >> Grape vines can can survive at 20°. But uh >> in Canada they have these late harvest frozen grapes or no >> can Canada. Well, this year we're going to see what's going to happen. This was a harsh winter and it depend the the the freezing temperatures lasted way too long. So we'll see we'll find out. Our biggest worry right now is comes June, May when the bud the flowering of the grapes comes out and then all of a sudden we have a frost and though very delicate and they get killed and then we have and then it's a it's a big problem and that's why we a farmer really dav and knows that you know he's in his hands saying to him to him he knows he has no control. Yeah, we're used to certain trends we follow. we know this is going to this happens these you know years for going on this way years going on this way but yeah the bottom line is you know you know who ever thought a hurricane will hit here >> so did that become your full-time pastor from 18 until today >> full-time business >> yeah so was very successful >> we're going to take a we're going to take a small a small break tok >> to talk about our sponsors besides drinking a lot of wine on pes four cups of wine it's very important to have very very mud kashmir matzah. This is the handmade matzah made in Brooklyn. Made out of flour and water. Nothing else. >> Brooklyn water. >> Brooklyn water. The best water in the world. This is the matzah that the reb used to eat. >> Malano. >> Yeah. Yeah. This is the mat that >> Well, the spring >> 100% from 770 spring 770. >> This is the matzah that's baked by Labavich on Albany Avenue for the last 100 years. And um this matzah is the one that the Reb used to use and give out and distribute. It's the most quality matzah, the most kosher matzah, and the tastiest matzah. Um, so again, what's the uh the website is >> and and they've and they've succeeded in making them thin. >> Yeah, now they're very thin. They used to be a thicker, now they're thin. Just a little highlights. It's uh labavichmatza.com. You use code clappy Frank and you get uh what was it? It's 10% off. I heard there's some shortage of matzah because of Israel and the shipping that >> I don't know but definitely it's sold in in Crown Heights. It's sold in all matzah stores including their bakery on um Albony Avenue. Albany and the corner of Empire in Albany. You could get it in Pomegranate KRM meases Glatt Martin Avenue M and Muny. It's at Rockland Kosher Evergreen Wesley kosher and grocery store and many many more locations. This is the finest quality matzah. The taste is phenomenal. Use the code clappy Frank. I think it's 10 or 15% off. Phenomenal. Phenomenal matzah. Delicious. >> To bring your kids to the bakery in Albony Avenue. This is the matzah we're going to be using in our house. Not in Ukra. Not Ukraine Africa matzah. No, the matzah. Local local local. >> If it's not crown chk. It also has our big relic from an Labavich. It's the top sher in the world. It says it doesn't get more kosher than this. >> Tonight's today is a CHK show. Rab Zon. I remember every year put it back. You used to put a picture rabbi Azda right used to put a picture on on the web co of Rabbi Azba coming to check out the the your wine >> sometimes. Not every time. >> It's in my head it's every time. >> Oh, really? >> Now when you're sitting at the matzah, you're sitting with the matzah and the zikon wine. You need a hagada. Now there's no room on the table between the matzas and the wine. There's no room on the table. So, Kahas produced a Hagada that takes up less than 25% of the table space of a traditional Hagada. How gorgeous is this? How gorgeous is this? It has all the rabbis bearim. It tells you when to break the matzah, when to drink the wine, when to refill the cup. You go on the website kahut.org and you put in clappy in the uh code, you get 15% off. Order them very quickly. They're selling fast. Comes in a gorgeous, gorgeous gift box. Everything packages really well from Kahus. >> Kus knows how to do things. >> They know everything they do is to perfection. >> Top. >> Top. Beautiful gift box. Beautiful Hagada. >> Yes. Clap. Which artwork do you prefer? The new Hagada work artwork or the old one? >> This is very modern. This is not the climate artwork, but this beautiful modern art. >> Stop dodging the question. >> I prefer the climbing Haga. >> The artwork. >> The art. This is more practical. The other one has nicer pictures. You buy both. They're both for sale at kahhat.org. >> If if we can go through the Hagada by just looking at the pictures, huh? >> Yeah. >> Moving on to our was our next >> Moving on to our next corporate sponsor. We have chocolate. >> It's not Pesak until you have chocolate. For Perm, we were telling everybody to buy the miners, the thin little skinny ones that are delicious. But for Pesak, you want to give people full bars. You want to get the kids to come to the seder table full bars. The best rim >> by the way. >> It's the healthiest healthiest. Is that the 85% >> the 72% coco? >> Okay, that's a little more. >> You get along with the neighbor Yasi or No. >> Sure. >> They look across the street. >> Schmuring chocolate. You want to get the kids to go in the car. >> Eating the 85%. >> If you want to get the kids in the car to go to the trips, you just go to the car and you start holding the bar of chocolate and all the kids come running. >> Schmuring chocolate is where it's happening. Lot of flavors. How many flavors are throwing half a pesa? 30. >> I don't know. A lot. >> It's It's high. >> And I was just telling his brother-in-law who's our new sponsor, Yasi Muhammad. >> Um, who told me I have to mention that Yasi learned with Rabbi Geriski for how many years? >> You have a share with Robert Gerwitzki? >> Since I'm 14. >> Wow. Shiva. Raitzky. Top top. Darwitzki. The senior. >> Boom. But on that note, and I know I've seen Yasim Mama learns with Galitski. No, he learns >> he's very close to >> and he just launched a new company called Oasismint. >> Oasismint.com. >> Yeah. Oasismint.com. >> Oasis Mint.com. When you want to buy gold and silver, you know, when the Gen left Mitsy, they left with all the gold and silver. Gold and silver are skyrocketing. You literally you buy billion from Oasis Silver, a trusted >> Oasis Mint. >> Oasismint.com. You want to buy from a trusted, reputable person. When you spend four or five grand on ounces of silver and gold, you buy bullion, 100 ounces, whatever it is they have on their websites. By the time they ship you the gold and silver, it goes up in price while you're checking the tracking. I mean, you want to get in. This is not speculative here. You're getting bullion. It comes into your house. You're holding on to it. It goes up. You could buy it for pennies above melt value. So, O8 has been involved in collectible. >> They're legendary in the world. Yeah, for sure. So, oasismint.com. >> You buy the gold and silver. You >> They have a great team there. >> Great team, great customer. >> Located in Brooklyn. >> It's a Brooklyn based company. >> Brooklyn based company. Empire Boulevard. >> Doesn't get better. oasismint.com. Gold, silver, bullion, collectibles. You buy it, by the time it gets to your house, it usually goes up in value. >> Speaking of Brooklyn, >> speaking of Brooklyn, when you go to the Hagada, when you do the Hagada, you need the Hagada. Hagada makes the legendary um lady fingers. They make the seven layer cakes. They now have individually wrapped boxes of little packaged cookies for kalamo trips to get the kids happy. Candies. >> How was the lux class? >> The bubbies luxion I bought yesterday and I you just take the lux instead of sitting in the kitchen for eight hours making luxion. You take the luxion, you dump it into your hot soup. Within a minute you have beautiful non- gibbrra egg noodles. Hagada now doesn't want you sitting in the kitchen the whole hour of pes for two hours grinding mr. You buy readym made myrrh the raanim every rub in the world said it's kasha for mr. >> It's dry so shelf stable. >> Shelf stable mr. Ooh. Can I smell it? >> It looks like the real thing. It smells like the wrong like the right thing. >> The real thing. >> Yeah. Yeah. The real thing. >> Especially places where getting horseradish raw in many cities if you're not in a hamisher city >> you can't get the stuff. >> You can't get it. No one's selling you horseseradish. Ready-made horseradish right in little individually wrapped. >> I want to have a horseeradish, right, CL? >> Yeah, it's not Araface. You could eat the horseradish. >> Oh, dama. >> Is it bitter? I don't want you to start crying on the show. >> Not bad. Nothing too crazy. >> Hagada chocolate bites. Get mini wrapped cookies. Delicious. Delicious cookies. We've been snacking them in the car for the last few days. Where all fine kosher groceries are sold. Look for the brand Hagada. Made in Brooklyn on Bergen Street. Yeah, >> it's like 10sec drive from 770. >> Mhm. He told me to 770 all the time. >> Beautifully familyowned. They make all the kosher pes with the best. They have over here the okay. Talking about the okay. >> There we go. >> It's got uh rabbit tidle bomb. It's of course shahak of course. >> Great for kids. >> Ready-made chocolate bites. >> If you're not a chocolatey person, readymade strawberry bites. Delicious. And then we got the readymade luxion. To me, delicious egg noodle luxion. I had it in my soup yesterday. It was absolutely delicious. I personally stand behind the hashka. I stand behind the taste of the Hagada products. Once you pop, you can't stop. >> From YT food says that he knows Hagada is one of the best. When I was in the factory, I wanted to touch one of the cookies like, "Oh, you have pes hands like like the mashia." I like, "Wow." No MSG, sugarf free, no artificial coloring, all natural ingredients, zero grams trans fat, delicious, no refrigeration required. You're traveling to Orlando, anywhere in the world. You don't want to sit in the kitchen for 10 hours making egg noodles to dump into all your soups on Pesak Hagada. You don't want to sit in the kitchen for 5 hours grinding Mr. the whole family's crying. You buy the readymade right out of the packets. You spill it into the caris. You spill it into your matzah and mr. Now, >> what about meat? If you need meat hang on, >> if you need meat on y or if your house is kosh and you need to eat in a fancy restaurant for the next few nights, ch Butcher. CH Butcher. Their beautiful restaurants on Troy Avenue. Their beautiful Butcher on Albany Avenue. CH Butcher. Get the Manhattan upscale experience on Troy Avenue and Albany Avenue. >> Longest sponsor, I think. >> Longest sponsor. Customers are all buying at CH Butcher. It's quality American Angus beef. Quality >> from >> PA in Pennsylvania. It's local. >> This stuff is local. It's good. Natural. They feed their cows natural ingredients. They give the cows nice, beautiful, loving it up. >> No, no, no. It's No. No. It's It's beautiful, beautiful meat. The stuff tastes amazing. And when it comes to Pesak, do not clean your car. You call my friends at wheels to lease. You ask to speak to Saul or my friend Izzy Herman. What's Izzy's number? >> You know what? You call you when you call Wheels to lease, you say, "I want a car in my driveway." 2, three hours later, you hear a nice honk and your shiny new car. Did I tell you the pricing lately? >> No. >> You call wheels to lease. They're giving people cars for 200 bucks a month. >> Can you tell everyone? >> It's like an over It's like >> Is he personal? >> Is it Is he will answer your phone at 4 in the morning and make sure your car is delivered before it pays off. >> Coffee. >> 845. Yes. >> 213. >> Yes. >> 9508. But you call wheels to lease. You ask to speak to Izziel Saul. You'll get quality. Pilots are in the 400 range. Odyssey's are in the 400 range. Senturas are in the $200 range. Don't clean a car. Just get a new car from my friends at wheels to lease and you're good to go. >> 100%. >> 1,000%. >> I just want to say I was excited to get wheels to lease because until wheels to lease, we looked like a very kabad only podcast and suddenly got the ha wheels to lease. They're a sponsor. You know, we brought in >> when you come into their office and you see 20, 30 people, phones and cars and honking and trucks are pulling up and cars are leaving and it's a it's a massive >> Yasi Fineman from Five Towns Jewish News told me he's like Moshi when I just started my magazine, the first and only sponsor I got was wheeliz they're they're cutting edge >> they're there to help you when you start >> and the thing with when I just started my drink I was all nervous tried to get involved in the drink business. I came to Yasi Zecon in his house on Montgomery Street and he was welcoming, encouraging. He was uh my one of my first cheerleaders. So >> that's the way that's the way we do it. >> First cheer, by the way. Clappy first cheerleaders, you never forget. When the guys all come on board, you're successful already blah blah blah. They'll say, "Oh, blah blah." Bro, no new friends. The guys in the beginning who there to start who help you to start, you never forget. from Empire Boulevard from the Chinese restaurant to being in the New York Times to companies saying they want to buy out everything you make in the Chardonnay Italians. We're not even talking about Hey Mishi and Friends, big multi- conglomerates saying they want you to sign the bottles and buy every bottle. New York Times giving you front cover exposure. How do you go from a storefront on Empire Boulevard to becoming a world recognized brand? What was your next step? >> Production. I needed to have a place to produce and to really produce in any quantities that it should make economically sense required a very big investment of uh money. And people were throwing money at me, but I being who I am, I said I'm not going to take money from people, be enslaved to people for something that I'm going to have to do work. And I'm not sure, you know, if that's the right way to do it, but you so I resisted and then um which happened was it was probably 198 I don't remember which year Mr. Herza called me and he told me you know let's uh you know maybe I can you his name was Rabbank Herzog Alba Shalom. He was the wine maker then and he says, you know, I like what you're doing and he met me actually at the show and he says, you know, maybe we could work together. So I said, "Okay." And they made him we made we had a meeting and it was like four brothers. Their father Yao was still alive, but he wasn't there. and in Williamsburg their their winery was then in Williamsburg and me the kid who knows very little about wine about the business end of it is there and they're telling me you know it would be nice if we can do things together and y'all will help you make whatever you want and how you want and you can continue doing it and you don't and you don't have to worry about the financial part of collecting the money from the stores which is also not an easy job >> telling me Okay. So, I I said, "Okay." And uh I was listening and uh then they told me, you know, we'll draw up a contract and let's tell us what you think. I I walk out of there, you know, okay, a little bit dizzy because these are four >> veterans in the industry. >> Hungarians. >> Yeah. In the industry. And they they understand the dollar sign. I don't >> artist. You're a true artist. You're a true artist >> and quit a contract and I don't know where to turn >> but then David Shalom. I don't know if you knew him >> from Connecticut. >> Yeah. >> The found like a big supporter of Alterra >> very support but he was a very close friend of my grandfather Matlin the cipher >> and he also >> he was also very you know he liked me a lot. He always used to talk to me whenever he had a chance. So I would I asked him what should I do? So, so he tells me I know a guy, a lawyer that can look at it and know what to do. Lawyer never passed away already, but he was a young guy, a young kid. Literally a young kid, but what do I know? >> Were you in a good cash position when you met the Herzog or not so great? >> I don't know what cash meant. >> Okay. So, not good. >> No, I mean saying yeah, for me it was, you know, I didn't cash wasn't the there wasn't the cash thing that was there. I had my my my little sports car that I needed, you know, so that was good. A Datson 280ZX. I mean, that bought it bought it for half price without wheels. Put on wheels. That's how I used to function, you know. And uh and then he told gave me this name and then he this lawyer this which was mama she said he was a young guy young was younger than me or maybe my age >> in your late 20s. What age were you at that time when Herzog approached you? >> I was in my 20s. Yeah, >> late 20s. >> And he tells me, I know the right guy for you, Madison Avenue lawyer. How am I going to pay him? He's our lawyer. Don't worry. Go and meet with this Madison Avenue lawyer. And literally, this is the funniest. I mean, really, this guy's buying and selling companies, not just a lawyer. He's rich. He's he he's this is his life. He looks at the contract as very nice. I think they're giving you way giving you everything that possibly they you know they really really and he just made a few changes there to make sure that you know everything will be work out well and he told me let's see maybe if they'll accept it and within a day they accepted it and that was the the rest is history. 1988 >> and yeah the guy and the lawyer charged me was like nothing. He didn't even it was like he just charged me so I should he shouldn't I shouldn't feel like I'm a seducka case. So you know what it was like $1,200 I think. >> So you in 1988 you were basically bought out by by the biggest comp. >> I wasn't bought out. We did a partnership. You're you're a partnership. >> I'm going to do whatever I have to do. >> Right. We I wasn't married yet and we made then and then he was so it was such a good uh relationship I had that I I crave for it every day almost. We took then three grapes, a seal blanc, which was a French hybrid, a Reisling, which is a venifra, and a Chardonnay, which is a venifra in the Fingerlakes. And I showed him New York >> to blend. And we made a wine, a dry wine, and it was my wedding wine, and it sold out right away. And it was a gorgeous label said Michelle on it. And >> Michelle was Michelle was your wife. >> Yeah. >> Romantic. That was that was our wedding wine and it was like such a good dry wine. People didn't drink dry wine yet. >> How old when you got married? >> But we sold it. I was 30. >> Wow. >> Yeah. And but you know there was Bashar. >> What year you got married? 88. >> Yeah. >> Wow. Tismach year of happiness. Tismach was I think I got married. Oh >> I don't remember. >> So you do production and they do all the sales and marketing. So they Yes. So I'm busy making the wines and making sure wines come out a certain way and I'm you know and I have to always and we you know and they they decide basically if if let's say a customer doesn't pay I'm not going to sell them. If a customer pays I will go there and I will talk to them. Like one of the most beautiful things we were in Florida right after Pur Michelle and we we went just to the stores. We didn't go to sell them. They were good customers. the guy the the the distributor told us these are people that are love your product and they're going to stand behind you. All we did is we walked in me and Michelle and said thank you and they loved it. >> We were talking about that yesterday have to thank their customers. What store was this? >> All the stores in Florida >> that you visited. >> Yeah. >> So you're involved in not really in sales and marketing a little not so much. >> Right. My my main thing is production, but when they see the person who's making the wine and he's not the guy who's harassing them to buy another case of wine or to pay, they love it. So for me, that was worth it. Before I got into the food business, for me going to Kosher Fest, meeting the founders of all these brands I grew up with was like it was like crazy. I walk in each they give me golden fluff pop. Oh my gosh, you're the guy. I go to the next guy, you're the I was like I was in a different planet. All these brands are coming alive. And my sister, I just brought her, she's she has a WhatsApp group to sell kids clothing. I brought her to her first children's clothing show in Manhattan. She's like going crazy like you're the person you really you're the one that makes these sweaters. You're she was so the same thing is to have a founder meeting the founder. Now today in 2026 with social media I would say all the successful brands are brand driven. You know the founder the founders talking I I interviewed the founder of Poppy soda that sold for I think four billion to Pepsi and she said I said I interviewed I said hey give some tips for any new founders said make sure you're talking to your audience every single day in social media. I tell Clappy all day long I hit him over the head. I said Clappy we need to make a video. We would leave the gym let's make it. So it became like a seder, right? Leave the gym. >> I'm telling you, you you you this you what you're saying is very important for a lot of businesses and you can do it with with AI is so much simpler and you you might have a niche to to to offer. >> I was today I want to I don't want to say the name. One of our newer sponsors, I was fighting with her. I said, "Bro, if you're going to advertise on our show, you have to say your name. If you don't have your name, who are you? You're some random company of nowhere." And I fought and fought and fought and fought. I said, "I'm I told him on the phone, I he's offering us money." I said, "I'm not putting you on our show as a sponsor if we don't mention your name." >> Basically, we'll we'll turn down corporate sponsors. We'll turn them away if they don't let us brand it properly because we have to believe in a company that we promote. >> And I I told him selfishly, if I don't mention your name on the show, no one's going to buy from you. If no one buys you, you're not going to advertise with us. So, we selfishly want to make sure we know your ad's going to do well cuz people want to know who's the person. Who's the person behind? That's why it was so cool. >> How many people came over to you in the street motion the last four days and say they want to buy a hat from the guy we had on last week. They said we finally put a name in a face. >> Exactly. >> People want to know what they're getting into, who's standing behind their product. >> The story, the trust. People make fun that people spend what, $30,000 on a Hermes bag, but you're spending you're buying into their marketing, their ads, their billboards. the emotional feeling they give you. When I drink Yasi Zecon's wine, it's not just wine. I think about all the times he helped me with my own brand. I met him. I know his obsession, his artistry towards a brand. So, I would say for all brand founders, old, new, old, make sure you're on social media talking to their audience. At least if you're so horribly shy from the camera, at least visit your store owners. Show up. Show up. introduce yourself because people want to know who's a person, who am I talking to, who am I trusting. >> The part that I love the most is that I know I know Abby for many years. I didn't know that he grew up thinking that all the wine tasted terrible and that he wants to change it. Making wine in his mother's basement, calling the health department asking them how he could get a permit. So when I when he when he was doing it then, now he has 50 more years of experience. So now the stuff's only going to start tasting better and better. >> Look at him. He doesn't like dry wine. Look. Look at him. Ah, I got to get a few. >> Yi, you got married at 30. Totally off. What do you tell people? I mean, your age, in your era, getting married at 30, you probably the looked at the most cuckoost guy on the planet. In my your day, I got married at 28. What was it like about getting married at 30? What was that journey like? >> Oh, I'm not going there. >> I had a fun life. >> You had a fun life. Okay. >> You have to understand I was a celebrity. >> Oh, during that school? Yeah. Oh, okay. So, it was kind of crazy. I mean, I had Joe. I was my my cousin Brana Schaefer. I don't know if you know her. >> My neighbor. My parents. >> Yeah. You should have her on. >> Oh, I'd love to have her on. She has an open invitation to come on the show. She's a legend. She gives Kawa classes. She'll buy his classes. >> I was very close with her. >> She's your cousin. >> Yeah. >> How? >> Her mother and my father, brother and sister. >> Her mother's maid name is Zach. >> I didn't even know this. >> Zeon or Zach? >> Zakon is the real name. >> I know. Mikoslavin is what? It's her brother. It's her brother. her younger brother, she's the oldest, >> right? So her husband, Gadalia Schaefer, he was my Google growing up. Anything I didn't understand, I I used to talk to him and speak to him and he was such a sadic. I mean to me he still an unbelievable sadic and uh and we had a I used to have a share with him actually and I used to love it and and he was the one who you know yeah you're crazy to make one and I love it too. It was, you know, very interesting, you know, a very sincere, beautiful man. So, I'm Brana, for example, I owe her a coffee breakfast. I keep on pushing it off. She was telling us to come and that's my fault. But, uh, so she took me once to off Broadway show with Joe Pap. You don't even know who these people. >> I know who Joe Pap is. He had the humanitarian fune. He was a big humanitarian. >> Let me tell you where. >> Are you on the board? Are you the board of >> Let me tell you where it is. Yes. Are you on the board? >> I have no idea. I was maybe I don't know. >> So, uh, so what board you're on, but you're off your >> So, I'm sitting all the way I'm sitting all the way in the back because what do I I'm going to go sit. What is it? What I'm going here? But she went me and she and I'm going for the first time in my life. I'm looking what this is all about. And there's this guy Kevin Klene who just started out in the industry and he was his mentor. And he and he sits down next to me, Joe Pap. and he's and he's like analyzing how Kevin Klein is performing and then he starts telling me uh do you know Rabbi Krinsky he passed away I think Joe Papsky it's a lang I said sure I know Rabudel because Rab Udel I told him yeah I won a medal of my wine and Udel brought it to the rebu and this was like Reb just came back from the aisle and the reb was holding it and he said this should you know be publicized >> said that you're getting a medal for wine should be publicized >> oh clap we have to go down the river we didn't discuss >> no I don't want I don't usually go down I'm bringing this up from >> so was very proud of this >> I'm just telling you what happened meanwhile he's telling me >> that I should give regards to yudel and he starts talking to me in yiddish because he's from William he knew yish and we made a connection then with braa and And that's how he came to was also involved with civashem and that's how he got we got him to come to civ hashem to start humanitarian with his wife who wasn't Jewish you happened to >> so this entire thing was a brun for matz >> yeah and I was there >> hold on did you sit next to him because he knew you were it or was random >> random very random random I told you I don't I don't know how I ended up in places you used to use your wine >> what >> the rebang has had your wine or not >> yeah not always and before there was other wines >> before was What? >> Ganella slinger. I don't know. >> Some syrup. >> No, whatever it was. Then you know then till >> but then then they use your fing wine until they Yeah. Then they started using the wine. >> And your wine is used by every year. >> Yeah. Most 99% of the time >> and I always you should have clapped. I always think what type of deal did the do with him? Did he donate it? Did he sell it? What price? You should every time I see I get all like I think about product placements on every single table. It's amazing. I'm always bragging my head of asking what's the deal with the but I never ask him. I still won't ask him. It's not my business but it it runs through my mind. >> Ask men >> because it's the only I think it's the only branded item on the table because the sodas and pictures and the only brand you see is the Joseph Zeon wine >> on different wines also from time to time. >> Yeah. >> But you so nice talking about persistence. As I remember was learning director in Gil, New York and I believe your son Yeti was a learning teacher. He was the most persistent. >> Oh, he just had a boy. Masle >> last night. >> He won He's one in Atlanta. >> In LA. >> He was the most persistent learning. Make sure his class got every prize and every this every this every He was so persistent. >> Perfection like wine perfection. >> So persistency runs in the jeans. I'm just saying on camera, off camera. >> So then so here let me ask this question from a business perspective. At what point should you bring on a partner distributor like you did? You did it 10 years in. >> So again, you're asking me a question. I didn't look it. It came to me >> and that's why I am like an anomaly in this whole industry in a sense. >> Y did you always have when your 10 years of celebrity stardom, did you always have a ton of money or there are ups and downs? >> There's always ups and downs and I never had it and I you know I was >> you want somebody almost closed down. Could you tell us more about that? Yeah. Well, >> we need some drama on the show. We can't >> We can't all be roses here, Yasi. Sure. It doesn't make a good show. >> Sure. I'm telling you right in the beginning. >> When he told me his dramas on the phone, how he almost closed out, he said, "Okay, we need to book him." Until then, it was a perfect. We said, >> it was very simple. Tell me more. When you sell out everything you make, but there's not enough cash to build more, you keep on going in circles, and that's not good. That's where you thinking, what am I wasting my time? That's really the hard times. >> Explain that. You sold that at profit. So, what's the issue? >> Right. But the the profit is not enough to >> to make more >> to make a lot more to you know whatever it is. It just becomes it's >> when you're not a real businessman you can end up in this cycle. >> Success success could be an issue because you need a lot more money to become more successful. >> Right. >> So when did you almost close down? How many years in? >> No I mean it was a that was probably five. I mean I didn't I never I didn't >> You told me on the phone before we booked that you almost closed down. What year was that? What happened? >> It started in ' 81. I'm not clappy and that's 88. So your horses, right? So I don't remember exactly when >> what was the story and how you almost closed down. We need some >> I think one year I couldn't get my money back from one of the stores and and without the money where am I going to go buy grapes? I said, "Okay, we're not going to do anything this year." And then somehow the money came. So I was able to do it. >> Were you ever at the verge of shutting down, Yosi? >> Yeah, for that reason. >> Couldn't get How many years in? >> It must have been five years in. And then that one account did not give you enough cash flow to stay open. >> Yeah. Everything counted. Every penny count. >> How big was the bill? >> It was a few thousand dollars. It doesn't matter. >> If you started over us, you tell a new a guy wants to start making wine today. How could how um first of all, how does you find how would you tell them? Give them three steps how to start their own wine brand today. I see. Do they knock on door? Store owner. Should they go to distribution? Are there legalities? Could you self-distribute in New York state or New York to New York? You're allowed you. Could you give us some insight on that? Yay. >> Okay. So, let me give you some preface. I started making wine not to make wine because the Goyam are making wine or like the Goya make wine, but because I wanted to have good wine to drink. I had no idea what Goisha wine was. No, no, no in the world that I have any idea what it looked like. >> You're filling a gap. >> What it looked like? >> He's eating mar. What's going >> it's sweet? >> No, >> I think they sprinkled it with coconut sugar. >> No, that's a good hashture. >> No, we don't need sugar. So, coconut. Yeah. So, you didn't know. You just wanted to make a good product. Okay. >> That's all I was. 99% of the people in the wine business that went into the wine business, oh, you know, they're they're here to compete with the goim or make wine taste like the gyim. >> I never tried that. I never went that route. That was the funny part about it. I just made wine because it said in the book that's how you make wine. So that's the first thing you should know. Was it stupid? Was it crazy? Absolutely. Would I want to do it again the way I did it? No, I would not want to do it again the way I did it. >> So how would you advise a new burner to start? >> So I I and to be honest, the to to be in this business to go into this business is not a money maker. You're not going to see any profits >> for how long? A minimum of 10 years. >> Wow. >> A minimum of 10 years. And it's just not a >> trying to prevent people to get into any way you cut it. What? >> Are you just trying to prevent people to compete with you? You're saying really on the contrary, if someone wants to do it and thinks he he knows how to do it and he wants my reasoning and explanation, let him call me. >> You're available for mentorship. >> I will. Yeah, whatever. I'll tell him exactly. >> He mentored me. He's not just >> I have no I have no no problem. I mean, I I love when pe when people making wine. To me, I I love seeing people making a good wine. For me, that's the most fun, you know. Wow, you did something amazing. You tried something and it came out amazing. And I love that. >> And all your bottles to be proud of. >> They're all under $20. What's You're still you stuck to that budget thing, right? >> So, whatever. This is a >> retail. What's your highest retail item here? >> I think the nature screaming. Oh, there's the port. I don't know which one. I didn't bring the port. >> 20. >> Yeah, about $20. $21. >> Yi, what's the reason behind making that grape juice? What was your just for to get CHK? >> Which grape juice? If I bring a grape juice. >> Yeah, that was for the community. It's basically a community. >> Is it the same as a kadm or different? >> It's sometimes different, sometimes the same. It depends, you know, who who has grapes, they got to go, they got to move out fast one way or another. >> When people say kadm tastes different every year. Is that true? The kadum grape juice or your grape juice could taste different every year. Is that true or false? >> Grape juice is literally a food that spoils the moment it is pressed. Wine you start preserving a little bit with the alcohol as it ferments. So it has a longer chance of of of of stand of of of standing up. Grape juice is food. Food food. The moment you start cooking, the moment it hits the oven, it >> So would it make sense that it changes year to year? >> Yeah, absolutely. Can they change it in three months? It's a different taste. >> So when people tell me because since my original brand was grape juice and celtzer, people say start giving all their feelings and opinions about grape juice. The grape juice this year is different. It's not different. The taste you saying in grape juice varies just like wine. >> Yeah. More than wine. >> More than wine >> for sure. >> Because it's >> because it's a food and the food the minute it's made into put in the into the bottle it's you know it's the the oxygen starts you know changing it >> or almost half the bottle's almost done. CL >> Jesse any of any of your children are passionate about wine like you are? Uh they're all passionate, but none of them, everyone realized that it's not a business to be in uh for many different reasons. I'm not going to elaborate. But one might one might be more than the others. But meanwhile, he doesn't he's not he's not getting he's not involved yet. >> Maybe a future son-in-law that has to stay in the family. >> Maybe whatever it's all in Hashem's hands. I mean I mean you know I've done I'm I'm I'm so happy that Hashem gave me the opportunity to be able to do something that I love and that I like and that I can continue doing it. And I do have to be grateful to the Herzuk family for that because you know they took a very big burden off my shoulders. And now when it comes to selling especially they know who are the guys you can sell to who are the guys you cancel. There certain guys if you bring them the wine they'll they're not going to pay you or you're going to wait and if they'll pay you will be a year later because another wine >> but legally you have to pay the same day right it's legally masled >> no 100% it's days >> who enforces it >> the government who enforces it on people >> no so it's it's a big problem it's a very big problem >> alcohol just so for people should know there's a rule that it has to be three layers right has to be a owner distributor and a store owner correct A wine maker, a winery can be the winery, could be the distributor, and could be the retailer >> in state. >> Yeah. In state, >> out of state, there has to be distributor. >> State you needed. Yeah. Each state is >> legally No, there are some states you could sell directly to, but but most of them >> the kids are it's very a very regulated industry. >> Very regulated. >> Why? For stupid reason, right? No good reason >> because every state wants to be a boss >> on alcohol. We're learning we're learning now with Trump trying to get things done. every how every state is showing we're somebody's till now we we didn't realize that they were somebody's now all of a sudden because of Trump everyone is a Trump is a somebody a new phenomenon >> people ask world >> people ask all the time why are you getting into drinks why you do alcohol I said I'm not good with rules and I'm staying away from alcohol >> so if I was good at rules I would consider alcohol I'm so bad with rules in theory >> I would be arrested the first day I'm in alcohol business >> in theory 50 states so you have to deal with 50 sets of regulations on distributing. It's it's a lot of paperwork. It's ridiculous. >> But there's a lot of leniency leeway for instate like states like New York. If you're selling >> if you're making the wine in the state >> in New York and you sell in New York, there's a lot of >> a lot of the wines here from all over. >> Yeah. You have certain importers who are selling retail. That is also illegal if you're an importer. But you know, it's what it is, you know. But who cares? >> Who cares? >> Exactly. So, all your bottles are under $20, right? Yassi, >> the Yeah, I I don't have expensive wines. Maybe one day I'll move to some in Lebanon. Maybe one day in Lebanon, I'll be able to make some Yes. I asked you the question before >> because you know, my dream is to move to Lebanon. Really? >> Becca Valley because it says that the wine for Mikdash came from Lebanon. The cedars came from Lebanon and the wine came from Lebanon. >> And there's no wine coming from Lebanon now today. >> Not kosher. >> 2026. It's dangerous. You got to rock. I have a few I have I have a few contacts there who grow grapes and >> Oh, so why don't we do that cuz it's >> No, hold on. Settle down. Could we say we're launching next year? We'll have it. >> No, I'm saying to Has to say no. Can you please read what it says on the label? >> No, no, read it in English. >> I you know, you just reminded me in Clappy. >> No, the the eminent. I was so proud that for many many years before Yi Jacobson reached the world the only message that Reb guaranteed had that went out to the world was Yasi Zecon's little veral you would put on little wine bottles that would reach everywhere like the you have one about Fabangan right the power of Fbrangan the only if in a weird way the Reb's biggest to the world was Yasi Zon's bottle of his writing >> hold one second it says on this year's bottle it will certainly be the year of our redemption. Amen to that. >> That's the Google translation. >> Literally the Google translation of >> Do you have any interesting story with wine and the Reb? >> No, I don't. I don't use Reba cards. >> You don't use Reb cards? I just because I don't. >> I'm just telling you what happened. That's it. And >> did Reb give you brahas for your wine business? >> Yeah, all the time. >> Any specific? >> No. Reb doesn't get involved in these things. >> When you came with a new wine, you asked a braha. I mean, you did that type of thing. >> Yeah, for sure. every time. >> Yeah. But you didn't The Rebel likes when you did something on your own and you showed him this is what I did and and pray that you didn't do but you don't get something you should have done it that way or this. No, but here's my here's my question. Guys like Avan Freed and Machnik and many other artists, they talk Rebbit stories like about this wine, the Reb said this and this music record, the Reb said this. Every time they go on stage, they have a Reb story. You don't try to Why don't Why don't you push the Rebbit card? Why not? >> It's good for branding. I don't I don't I don't don't have any. >> Imagine you say when I launched eminent I wrote into and this and that and did wrote back and now buy four bottles. >> You know there was one year I made >> cash in. >> Hold on. >> I'll tell you something interesting. One year I made Pesak vodka. >> Mhm. >> And that year DV gave out for THAT VODKA. >> WHOA. OH, >> and I didn't for some reason I don't know. I never got I got I never got from anyone this this bottle that Reb gave out. He gave out to Rabbi Khadakov. Could be my grandfather didn't get that year already because he wasn't well. >> Madlin. >> Yeah. Because my grandfather used to get my grandfather and I would have known. I would have had it. But his grandson in Connecticut. What's his first name? Khadakov. uh tells me that I saved from year to year the Reb's mashka that was we didn't have to sell it to go so we could have it you know >> ah the rebba gave your mashka which was he didn't have to get rid of it and he has it cuz usually every year >> you have that >> he gave me a small bottle >> so you now have to mix it in and you could say it's vodka and charge $400 a bottle and cash in once and for all >> and then and then make some ink with make some ink with it make a painting. >> That's a tougher. >> So you don't right now you do not vote on Jakashka? >> No. It was a very harsh business. It's too much. People only like Smeirnov. They don't care. It's you know that's what they all today. It's grey goose. No >> tequila. Tequila. Forget out. >> Whatever. No, but I'm just saying only gave out smirv. My grandfather used to get always he was the cion that would get >> zeon is a European. Where what's your background? >> It's a Russian name. Ukrainian name. Sakon. boys or which other brand were you? No, my father my my father was from >> square >> during the war they he went to lab and tashkent and they were very wealthy then actually and >> no they lost everything coming out >> they he regained it got back the money >> my my father was on a flying on an airplane from Moscow to Tashkant when he was 14 years old I didn't go on an airplane till I was 18 okay how old you first went on a plane. >> Eight. Went to visit my sister in California. >> 12. My uncle's wedding in Florida. I still remember it. >> An 8-year-old and a six-year-old. My parents put us on a plane by ourselves. >> So, >> we went to California. They told the stewardist to keep an eye on. Nobody looks at us. >> No, but I'm going, you know, and my grandfather supported the whole Yeshiva Tashken then with gold. Bullion, whatever. >> Bullion. They bought it from the oasis. Of course, >> no one could understand. He he ran away from his house. He told my grandmother to make sure that they have a minion in the house. My father should know how to dab him and he was in the also be went to yeshiva there and then when they left they they got visas in 1946 to leave and on the way out they had a train robbery and everything was stole from them literally except for one thing that my grandfather's father my great-grandfather was a silver becker that he made from silver coins. He would go, you know, in those days the sadik would give you a silver coin for sodaka >> it's going also the rebal is not the first time the reb g it's a minute from >> and he saved he collected all those silver coins and made himself a silver becker >> and we used it for pes and that was the only silver becker only thing that was allowed to be brought into the fried reb's house on pes because by the freed was very strict p no one could bring anything in from the outside and only he was very close to the freed then when they came to America so he asks the freed should my father come back to so he tells him no leave him in lab he's in good hands >> in he said it to him you know >> was the original word >> lo him in labavich is in gutahent >> leave him in lab he's in good hands >> and then and then my father married my mother Matlin who's from G of the Sedic. So >> you're G. You're totally G, >> right? >> You obviously last. What's the worst part of of being in your business and the best part? First of all, it's the worst part. >> The hardest or the worst? >> When I when I'm when someone is not happy with what I make. >> That's the hardest part. >> That never happens. We're all people and you I make mistakes and some people have different tastes, >> you know, >> talking about taste >> and the be and the best part is when I see people like someone who says I never drank dry wine in my life just just down this bottle because it is a very good bottle and that's why I'm sold it's sold out. >> We have to negotiate. I would love to have off the record tell have you Zon's wine we'll drink it throughout the the podcast because it's much better when you have wine greasing the wheels. such a nice >> wants to speak to the yeah the marketing executive >> my first CPG mentor Yasi Z have his wine and table we'll have to negotiate with Gabriel Geller and Monty Herzog to make some time >> I'm sure they're interested >> don't don't worry we'll take care of it >> no it's >> oh that was the that was the good and the that's the good and the bad >> the good and the bad was the complaints >> and the best is the compliments >> I remember I remember when people send me pictures I'm drinking your drink I'm drinking drink here drinking J here but I'm just jealous to find to end Product placement is so important when you have a a beverage brand or any brand. And YC Jon has the best >> product placement. You go to Empire Kosher, he always has his boxes exactly smashed right in the front. He's saying it's there by mistake. Just trust me. It's not there by mistake. Trust me what it's attracts the customer. Do you know where my You know where Fibbran grape juice is? I just got a an email in Oregon, Portland, Oregon. They're selling fra juice. in San Jose, California to send selling fiber and grape juice, you know. And you know who did who did it? A lab guy. His name is Yakov Yarmov. >> Oh, Albertson's. >> Yeah, he's unbelievable. >> He's unbelievable to Yakov Yarmov who >> just a a random weird story. Yakov Yarmov who's a kosher and ethnic minor for Albertson's nationally. >> My my sister lives in Albany for a you know many years for Schlot and Shus and there had this shaw. There's a shaw there called the rabbi rabbi Ruben but the sh is not kabad and like and they make sure it's not kabad. It's like you know these people like >> okay >> and the only thing in the whole sh that was the kabad calendar. So I ask a guy so anti-abadan why is the kabad what's called the lash yeah >> how what's the deal he's like oh you don't understand this guy used to work for price chopper his name was Jakob yarmov he moved on to Chicago and Albertson's whatever Jelasco he made sure this luash was in and forever I don't know if it still is there this non-hating whatever hating this wereabad steel in New always had grand placement even for the >> Yeah. Yeah. >> So, unbelievable. >> Yakam is the best. He's a big >> He helped get my drink into Albertson in Julasco in Chicago. A real mench ofid. >> Um, >> there we go. >> Originally from Cincinnati where my in-laws are spent time and my in-laws parents, Dr. Hayes. Anyway, all Cincinnati rabbit. Anyways, when you're going to go shopping for Pesak, make sure you go to fine kosher wine stores and buy out the Zon Kesser >> Fabang all it's selling out so fast. Whatever they have still have from Kesser wine. You know it's going to be a quality product at a good price. Again, thank you so much to Basel Zhan for coming on the show and we wish you a Kasher and Fes and Aut. Thank you very much for having me. And I do want to finish again and say that the acronym of today of this year is produc the Google translation is this year will certainly be your redemption. We saw the redemption of the hostages already and we should be seeing the redemption of Israel this year. We should be in this year. >> Oh, come on. Clap. I just realized the only Jewish branded food product that has little verit on it in the entire kosher world is Yasi Zikon's bottles. >> I >> not one. I just I was just thinking about as he's saying his ver tell you something. I realize there's not a single oldest Hisha brands and this and that. You would think they're so spiritual and f and this and you know blah blah blah. The only kosher brand in the entire world that I could think of that has inspirational little ver is Yas. Tell me if I'm wrong. I'll tell you something more. When I first started the labels, making the labels, I was the first person to write on a label and we should be to drink the yammer now's wine and you know, we should be able to to have that and and unfortunately when the whole controversy came out about the Reb being Msiah and who knows, but I had legitimate people come up to me and tell me you believe the Reb is Mashiach and you know you can't you can't this can't do this we're not going to touch your wine we're not going to drink your wine >> I said I don't know what you're talking about this you know you want to drink it drink it you don't want to drink it don't drink it and I'm sorry that you don't like the concept of mashia >> that you talk about 10 times a day >> I didn't say the is mashia I just said we should be to the of our new tea line will have some inspirational lines it was always my idea to have little inspir Some brands still do like Celestial Seasoning always had little inspirational lines. Not >> Laffy Taffy had a joke. >> They had a joke, but they had little inspiration things and I or interestingly that Celestial Seasoning Tea was a sponsor of tea at the oil for many years. >> I think they still are. >> Not anymore. They're not. >> No, cuz the owner sold the company Seagull. >> Are you going to be having ver and zen? >> Zen in Zen. >> Zen is something with T's are like >> Yes. So M with Clappy's my partner's permission we're going to have a little nice ver and continuing your inspiration legacy that the food should have some >> see clap someone told me this recently that I have a complex since I grew up in Flappers and it was so I had this complex and people would hate on me that I always have that which is probably true. So when I would come to Flappers and see these little ver msiah and on wine bottles that were you know were distributed throughout the world you were loving it. It gave me a certain and pride like hey you know you know we're not just our own little planet but yon would use his bottles of wine uses his bottles of wine as a as a platform to share the rabb's message. Love it. >> You have to to be successful you have to be able to show what you have a passion for and what you believe in. That's really the key. >> Thank Thank you so much. >> Thank you.