🎙️Episode 27: What is money without meaning? With Curtis Lane

Losing a parent at a young age, the first in his family to graduate college. Today, one of America's premier finance professionals. This week with Curtis Lane on Jewish Grit. Welcome to Jewish Grit. This week we're really fortunate to have an amazing healthcare investor and adviser with us in the studio. Welcome Curtis Lane. Thank you for taking time out of your busy day to come here. >> Oh, my pleasure. >> So, thank God you're high in the investment world, healthcare investment, but I'm sure it wasn't always a bull peaches. Amongst the roses, there were definitely some thorns and we like talking about Jewish grit. Those moments which kind of push push us against the ropes. we got to come back and how we come back, how we rebound and how we succeed. If I ask you to think of one moment where you really need a Jewish grit to to make it out of it, what pops into your head? >> See, when I think about Jewish grit, I think it's embedded in everything that we do and it's part of our it's now become part of our genes. But for me, it wasn't some one event that I had to deal with at that moment. It's an event that affected my entire life, and that was the loss of my mother as a seven-year-old. >> Wow. And that creates, you know, a situation in which you're dealing with a loss and a trauma and it's a part of you for your entire life. >> And how did you how did you come out of that hole and successful? >> I'm still figuring it out. >> It's been a few years. It's been a long time, but still figuring it out, but it's very much a part of who you are and recognizing what things in your life had an impact on you. And at the end of the day, developing grit comes a loss of a parent. You know, you either compensate or you don't. And if you don't, you've got different type of problems. But if you do, that builds in for you grit. >> How do you compensate for such a thing? It just sounds like a whole your whole world collapses on you in one moment. >> Well, you don't really know about it. You're a kid, right? It's it's really the voids it leaves during various periods of your life and then how other people fill in and give you the love and and affection and support that you need. But a lot of it comes on you to have to do more than you might have done if you had had both parents. Do you feel that imp impacted you as as a parent as well? >> Big time. Absolutely. And I married a woman who lost her father. >> Wow. >> At six. So you imagine our first date. We have both, you know, we both lost our opposite sex parents at six and seven and our first date we found that out. So we're incredibly committed to our family and to having a stable family given that both of us never experienced that. >> So you've turned something really difficult into something solid for your family. my family and then also you know it's one of the areas of philanthropy that we're involved in is that you know it's something that we think about all the time and you know it's part of you and so after 9/11 you know when all the kids lost parents um was the first time I did something philanthropically and I helped set up a thing called America's camp which was a camp where our kids one of the camps that our kids in the northeast went to not one of the Jewish camps more of a sports camp uh where they went to that one of those camps basically hosted kids from 911 who lost their parents every summer for a week and that at the beginning there were bereavement counselors and others there and it became a real community. We got up to about 250 kids and they stayed in now that's they've aged out of needing a camp um but yet they created their own social you know interactive group and they still keep in touch with each other. It's been very nice and then now fast forward to what's happening in Israel. But we did that in Israel also with a some with a different approach because there are so many different or you know everybody was throwing money and resources and ideas um to Israel and I always knew that I wanted to approach this issue but I waited for it to shake out a little bit and then I went over a couple times and interviewed lots of different agencies that are working with orphans and um I went and I spoke to 10 12 of the NOS's that are dealing in different ways with kids of lost parents. Um, some are just financially oriented to be able to handle financial pressures and needs over the life. Others are more um, you know, community- based, others are therapeutically based. So, I went and I talked to all of them and I couldn't I wasn't sure where I was going to place my bet to spend my time and my and my money. Um, and I ran into someone who had put together what's now called the war orphans forum, which is basically, you know, given that everybody's running around, she had the idea, let's just make sure that we convene all the different organizations that are working in this area to make sure that there's no duplication and there are no gaps that go unfilled. And so, I've kind of gotten actively involved with her, helping her build the team and build out the strategy um to figure out how to get that going. and it's up and running and it's been very effective. >> Beautiful. Amazing. C can you take us back a little? So your kid is growing up without a mom obviously with all the trauma and difficulty. So how do you eventually become successful in terms of your profession and then become more successful and then what happened to you? >> You know, it's um I think at the end of the day it's the examples that are set for you. Um I'm the first person in my family to graduate from college. >> Wow. Um, my father came out of the ghetto and did the traditional, you know, his parents were Ukrainian. Um, and his father died, my my father's father died when he was 13 >> and my aunt was 16 and they lived in Brooklyn and my grandmother was a Zafic Ukrainian. Turns out she was pregnant when my grandfather died and they didn't have the money to be able to support that child who was put up for adoption. That's how poor they were. So my father made it out of that environment through the garment district just like so many others did. Um started making little girls clothes and got to middle class, one might argue upper middle class in Long Island in terms of like very much a part of our history. Um, but he raised my brother and I as if we're still in Brooklyn without any money. >> So even though we lived in an environment that was reasonably successful and comfortable, he treated us as if we had no money and yet had to work. >> So that's what we did and we learned how to work. >> So you go to college as the first in your whole family? >> The first to graduate. My brother tried it. It didn't quite work out for him. >> To each their own. Right. >> Um, what was your first job? >> My first job ever or my first job out of college? >> Out of school. Actually, talk tell us about your first job ever. >> I remember I I I still remember it. I was 11 and I put the candy out at the drugstore and I got paid in candy bars. So, my I didn't know I went to Wall Street as an investment banker, which I didn't even know what Wall Street was. So, I was at school and had gotten into a program that allowed me to do my my undergraduate degree and my graduate degree in five years. And so looking for a summer job of my during the first between my first and second years of my MBA, um, long story short, I said to a friend of mine, "What do we do this summer?" Who's in the same program? And he said, "I don't know, but I heard about this thing called Wall Street." And I said, "What's that?" And he said, "I'm not sure, but I think you do projects and it's finance related." And I had been an accounting major and a finance major, so it sounded okay to me. And so I got a job as a summer associate on Wall Street in 1979 and that's what started my career. >> But what what did you do that summer? >> I whatever they told me to do. >> Make coffee. >> No, you didn't make coffee but you do spreadsheets and things like that. Um but basically you know was before laptops and you know computers and stuff you did by hand. You did spreadsheets and presentations and decks and things like that. Once you started your own business, was it steady and gradual or you you hit some moments where like it made you rethink everything? >> Well, I had, you know, there's a generational issue about when you become an entrepreneur. So today's, you know, young professionals, they're intentional about being an entrepreneur. They go to school, they take classes, etc. My generation was not that way, just like my father's generation was not that way. >> And I started a firm by accident. It was that I had gone I had taken a step where I left a place I've been for a long time where I want to do something different and I went to a smaller firm where I was uh quickly knew I'd made a mistake. So one of the things that you know in terms of moments in time is how do you handle back to grit how do you handle mistakes? So I think the grit, you know, you can give examples. This is an example of of I guess grit is that I went somewhere and within three days I knew I made a mistake and I'd been a senior guy at a big firm and here I was at some place and it wasn't right and it didn't feel right. And long story short after a few months basically said no harm no foul and they said what are you gonna do? I said I don't know. They didn't know what to do. We were both embarrassed about it. And that led me to, you know, step back, figure out what to do. And I was doing business, but I wasn't comfortable because I wasn't in an organization that I felt a part of. And even though that year I probably made more money than I ever made before, I was miserable because I wasn't a part of something. And that convinced me to build something. >> At what point in your professional life did you all of a sudden realize that you need to become a giver or a substantial giver? >> That's all newer to me. Well, philanthropy may not be, but um Jewish philanthropy is last 10 or 15 years for me. Um but I grew up I had my father was you know involved with working with um kids with um the developmentally disabled kids which I ended up becoming once they decided to have young members on the board to put me on the board and they all quit and left me with it. Um but so I'd have been around philanthropy in some way but where it was really shaped is that I worked at a firm called Bear Sterns and Bear Sterns had a real culture of philanthropy such that actually as a partner you were required to give at least 4% of your income every year. Didn't matter where you give it as long as you gave it. And you know when you think about that before I became a partner I was I thought I was giving away a good amount of money to philanthropy but turns out I wasn't giving the 4%. And you know, you've got to be held accountable to it. And so I learned my philanthropy at Bear Sterns with mentors of people watching what they did and how they did it. Um, that's where I learned it. >> And how do you decide like, you know, where to invest your your your charity dollars. >> You know, you have to learn it. You have to learn what works for yourself for you yourself over time. And I've always had a mix of small local things where you can really see and feel what's going on. like America's camp, you can go be there and watch what's happening or my alma motto where I was on the executive committee of the health system where it's a huge organization 12 billion dollar budget and you know you have a different type of role so it really depends but a unifying thing for me is I'll give money to most people that ask for reasonable causes friends acquaintances or things like that but where I'm going to give most of my money is where I can give my time and then my time is a major part of my philanthropy to multiply and magnify the impact of my money. >> So you use your professional talents to make sure that your dollars are working as hard as they could >> or just mag you basically you know magnifying what the dollars do. >> You talked a little bit about the orphans fund but like as a Jewish person how did October 7th hit you? >> I you know everybody knows where they were. I was at a wedding in Lake Ko Italy of which there were it was not a Jewish wedding. was a very close friend of ours, daughter getting married and we were there and I'm on the phone with Israel, you know, talking to my I have cousins there and you're watching the news but yet and but you have to like pretend to be okay on the wedding. So that was um you know it was a tough moment for all of us. Then I went to Israel three weeks later. So I was in Israel in early November of 23 >> when things were still very scattered. >> Oh yeah, I went with that was my with AJC. I'm on um on the executive council of the AJC and associate chair of something but um so group of us went in um November of 23. >> And what did you see when you went there? >> In retrospect when I think about my first couple of trips there, I came away clinically depressed. I didn't know I was. But it was just so tough and people were just, you know, worried about the whether or not Israel would survive, right? So there's the the trauma of the loss of October 7th, but then the fear of what that meant going forward. And I do believe that period before the pager incident. >> Mhm. >> That from the time of October 7th to the pagers was probably the most uncertain period that I could ever imagine that Israel went through. Um but that was a tough period. I was there a couple times during that period and it was very difficult. >> What makes you most proud to be a Jew? the community and our ability to survive and our you know to your point about you know grit. It's how do we get here? I'm not a religious person. I don't it for me it's very cultural and community- based. Um I've tried to see if I can weave it back into spirituality. Hasn't really worked for me but I don't need it. Um, I've studied with some people to try to figure it out, but you know, I I struggle with the concept of benevolent God that would allow the Holocaust to happen or lose their parents. So, I struggle with that. >> Um, but that doesn't change my commitment to the community. But, so there's something out there that allowed us to survive all these years when everybody just wants to kill us and once again just wants to kill us. So my pride is survival is the fact that we can survive and prosper in an environment where people just hate us. >> What would you tell you have an opportunity to have a conversation with a kid who's one of America's top colleges and literally they're scared and what they're hearing from their professors from the students on the college campuses is really questioning their right to exist as a Jew as someone that's connected to Israel. What do you tell a student like that? >> Fight back and don't accept it. But every kid is different. It's easy for me to say that. I don't know what I would have been able to do or not do at that time in my life. Um, you know, how you function. I think it's a matter of just feeling good about yourself and to know that we've been here for for a long time. We're not going anywhere and these guys come and go and it's going to be painful. But if we do the right thing and stay with the fight, we'll be okay. But I also believe you have to fight. And I think too often in our history, we've taken it rather than fought. And I think we have to fight. >> Thinking back um as a as a teenager, as a child who clearly went through a lot of challenges, um certainly not knowing how life would pan out for you, particularly you know, fast forwarding 40, 50 years later, knowing what you know now, of course, what do they say? Hindsight is 2020. But what would you have told yourself like what what do you need to know or maybe what would you have corrected if you had a chance to? >> That's where becoming a father matters, right? is it's a matter of you know what have I told myself but more what have I told my kids right so I have three sons they're adult sons and you know there are certain things that we were very felt very strongly about it but one thing about you know having a successful life it's a balance of your personal and your professional life but that we work hard and you go to work and you spend a lot of time at work very you know important part of our lives and I said whatever you do I don't care what it is as long as you like it. Because if you don't like it, you're never going to put the time and the energy in to be as effective at it. So, I don't care what it is, but you better like it. And that was one important thing that I learned is like it. >> I agree. What do they say? If you uh if you love your job, you don't work a day in your life. >> I you know, why is work a projorative term? >> Correct. >> Right. I work. I like working. You know, some might argue I don't have to work. I >> I was going to ask you that question. Why do you work? >> Because I love it. >> Great. That's fantastic. I love working and I love working with younger people, you know, that know a lot but don't have the reps so that they have the experience that matters. >> Do you have any uh mentors that have really assisted you along your life either personal or professional? >> So I had one which is my first boss who actually was in charge of recruiting of the firm I went to work for out of business school and I worked then in his group for five years um passed away a couple weeks ago. So I've been thinking about this. Um, I got a note from his one of his sons and I knew his kids and everything, but it's really about work life balance. You know, we put a lot into our work. We're very worried about how we do, etc. And I was a I got out of business school at 23, so I was like a go-getter trying to get going and I'm working for this guy. And he was just a wonderful man. And I used to get frustrated because we had things to do, but yet he was worrying about his kids hockey program or the basketball this or that. and he had five kids. Um, and then he and I would be like, "What do we got to go to work, we got to go to work, we're doing all this." And so the irony of that one is so years later, he then after I left, I I got into started doing healthcare then, but then focused on it a little later. Some years later, he left and went to a venture uh healthcare venture fund. So, we stayed in touch. Didn't do much together, but we just stayed in touch. And at one point, he called me and asked me to come meet a company with him. And I said, 'I can't. He said, 'Why not?' I said, 'I'm going to my son's basketball game. >> So, a lot of yucks it right. So, it was kind of that that's what he taught me. >> Could you could I drill down on a little bit because I think a lot of the people who listen to this and view this are thinking about starting families and the importance of career. They want to have financial success. How do you balance that very delicate balance between your family and at the same time really building building your professional success? >> Well, you have to have a good partnership with your spouse. Okay? Right? because I think, you know, >> so shout out to your wife. >> She would she would argue that she's, you know, raised kids as a single parent. I was never around during the week and that was just a deal and she was, but on the weekends I tried to be there. Doesn't mean I wasn't working or traveling. Um, but I think it's a matter of having a partnership to be able to do that. But then it's a matter of just it's your attitude to prioritize it. And one of the things that's difficult is a question of where you work and whether or not they respect your commitment to your family. So, you know, working at a big investment bank, no one cares about whether or not you're going to go to a basketball game or not. You just got to do what you got to do. And um and I found and what happens at these firms is there's a lot of politics and a lot of your emotional energy goes to politics as opposed to doing your job. I was able to by starting a new firm My goal was what I had to do was very pure is build a business. I didn't have to worry about politics. It was build a business. >> Curtis, I'm asking a personal question. Is that okay? >> Sure. I might not answer it, but >> what makes you happy? >> Uh, it's a great question. I don't know. It changes. Um, you know, that's that's the you know, the goal to self-actualization is try to figure that stuff out, right? Obviously, my family, my kids, my grandkids makes me happy. work, developing the work, the making the money obviously is great, but that's kind of table stakes. That's what you're that's a measuring stick. Um, which is easy for me to say because I've been fortunate. Um, but it's about the development of people and them building being a part of a community where people are getting out of it what they need. And everybody everybody's different and building a team. I always tell people, you know, I I'm big on sports analogies and um you know, just because you're you want to play center doesn't mean you can. Maybe you should be a point guard because you're small and fast and dribble, right? Do a price up, whatever it'll be. But there are different roles on a team. You got to work it through. And I believe that people need to understand what they're good and bad at and to know where they fit and to help them figure that out so they can be more effective and make organizations work more effectively. >> So to someone that's starting up off their life and trying to figure so many things out, what's the best piece of advice you could give them? >> Is understand success is not a straight line, right? That's one of the things I think is an issue is that people look at us at my generation that might have been, you know, we're successful and they say, "Oh, look, they did it." and our kids might feel the same way. Look, they look where they are. Um, but success is not a straight line and they have to understand that it's going to have its ups and downs and that hopefully at the end of the day it's an upward trajectory, but there'll be times when it'll be down and that's just part of life and you've got to be able to as you started this discussion with in terms of being able to overcome it with grit, but just accept it, deal with it and keep going. >> This has been extremely insightful and I appreciate the opportunity to pick your brain. >> Okay. I wish you loads of success in your professional life and your the great things that you're doing for the Jewish people. And uh thank you so much for coming. >> Thank you for listening to Jewish Grit and Ol mentorship podcast. At Mentorship, we believe that everyone needs a mentor. What better way is there to tap into your personal and professional potential than with a Jewish mentor at your side. Learn more at olam.org/metorship. 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