🎙️ He Almost Quit at 22. Now He Runs Royal Wine - Episode 53

Nathan Herzog is the president of Royal Wine Corporation, part of an eighth-generation wine-making family that has helped turn kosher wine into a serious force in the global wine industry. In this episode, Nathan shares what he learned about building a career from the ground up, growing a family business, dealing with uncertainty, and why the way you treat people matters just as much as what you achieve. There's a lot here for anyone starting out and thinking about not just the career they want to build, but the kind of person they want to be along the way. Welcome to Mentorship in a Moment. In today's episode, we are honored to welcome Nathan Herzog to the podcast. >> Thank you. I think when I say l'chaim to somebody in the Herzog family from Royal Wines, Herzog, Kedem, maybe it has a different connotation. What do you think? >> Sure does. Sure does. Taste the flavor. >> I'm assuming that probably most of the people that are watching or listening to this have tasted at least one good glass of kosher wine, and chances are that it's connected to you and your family. >> I sure hope. >> Okay. >> I sure hope. Thanks thanks for hosting me. We have many many different brands in our family of wines. The most famous one is Baron Herzog or Herzog Reserve wines from California. We have Bartenura, which people call the the fun young wine, low alcohol Moscato. We have Kedem, and then we import many many Israeli wines like Barkan, Carmel, Psagot, Shiloh, Castel, etc. etc. Many many different brands in our portfolio. >> bring a lot of happiness to a lot of people. >> Baruch Hashem. >> How do you think back to when you were in your 20s, which is I think where most of the people that are listening to this are find themselves in life, um and then where you are right now, what is the biggest difference in understanding about life, about career, from when you were young and where you find yourself currently? >> What I find very important [clears throat] is that time is very important and patience is even more important. What I mean by that? Now I'm going back I'm not giving you my age, but 40 years ago when I was a young man, I'm 21 years old and and invited to come into the family business. I was the first of the third generation in America, meaning we're eight generations in the wine business, but the third generation in America welcomed to come in and I'm a bit of the oldest of the gen gen three as we call it. To come into the family business, my uncle invited me in. He has a job for me as a salesman. And I started working very hard. I was a married, I had two young children running around selling wine. >> Yeah, 22 maybe. Sorry, 22. 22 two young kids and running around being a salesman for Royal Wine in Brooklyn, Staten Island, New Jersey. And I worked very hard. And there was no cell phones, there was beepers, and my uncle was looking for me, he had to beep me at the public phone. And calling me, it sounds like the dark ages. >> It does. >> it's 40 years ago, 1983, 1984. And calling the office and I worked very hard and I was running and running. And every few months I'd have this butterflies in my head. Why am I stuck in this small was a small company at the time producing some wines locally, and some imported. And some of my friends were doing real estate and venture capitalist and nursing homes. You know, I should something different, something more fun. And the hard you work and and and you see different things and and I went to my rabbi Manchester Rosh Yeshiva of Segal, that's where I learned for 3 years. Rabbi Yehuda Zev Segal was a big tzadik in Manchester, England. And probably after a couple of years in the business, and I asked him, "Rabbi, I'm I'm doing okay. I'm making a living. I'm happy, but I want to do something else. I want to just I see my friends are doing different things." And he and I remember never going to forget his answer. He said he said in Yiddish, but I'm going to repeat it in Yiddish and then in English. He said, "Yochonan." My Hebrew name is Yochonan. "You're a young man, you're a younger man. You just started in business. Wait a few years. Wait a few years and by the time you're 30, then going to make a decision. Where do you want to go? Whether you're staying in the family business or you're going to do something on your own. And guess what? By the time 30 came along, he was left already. He wasn't here. And Baruch Hashem was very happy with the decision he told me and I'm here to say the story that I'm now president of the company and I'm here and I'm happy cuz you have to listen to smarter people, the older people, the wise people. It's not always your instinct and incline. Maybe the grass is greener on the other side. Maybe I can maybe I can do this. You have a good business, it's a family business and it works. Stick to it. Wait Wait a little bit. Have patience. >> Did you ever dream when you were in your 20s that that the that your wine business today would be where it is? >> Never. Never. But Baruch Hashem >> What happened? >> Mostly, let's not forget we're big believers in Hashem. Hashem uh gave us the success of uh teaching the uh non-religious Jewish community all over the world to start drinking better wines. In the olden days, as you know, it was all sweet wines. It was Kedem, Manischewitz, Lipschitz, Kedall & Longar. All the So, when you said kosher wine to the non-religious community, it would be old-fashioned sweet wine and they they drank it only during the holidays. We decide My uncle, David, who's our chairman, decided it's time to produce some Bordeaux wines, some Italian wines. Great wines that happen to be kosher. That's an old slogan of ours, by the way. And we produce wines in Bordeaux, wines in in Italy, in Spain and the consumer started saying, "Wow." Especially a non-kosher consumer who drinks non-kosher wines, but during the holidays you want something kosher and they realized, "Wow, there's some amazing wines that are kosher." And and we spend a lot of money on marketing, educating, tasting and so much so that today we produce wines in about 15 countries. We have over 850 different types of wine and we have wines, especially the Herzog Reserve wines from California. I'm sure many of you listeners or watchers have had it. We've gotten ratings, you know, in in the wine industry, ratings anywhere from 80 to 100, 100 being the top score. We have a bunch of Herzog Reserve wines that got 96, 97, 98 ratings. Not from the Jewish press, from the real the wine the wine industry, Wine Spectator, Wine Enthusiast, James Suckling. So, education was a big part of our business. Educate the millions of non-affiliated Jewish people that you can have great kosher wines, and don't be embarrassed to show off and taste them and enjoy it during Passover and all the holiday Rosh Hashanah, you know, just passed us, and you can have great wines that happen to be kosher from all over the world. >> As you travel around the world, cuz I'm sure you have relationships and you you're producing wine, are you sometimes concerned about being Jewish? Or overtly Jewish? Outwardly Jewish? >> Sometimes, unfortunately, the last 10 years, yeah. I travel all over the world, you know, Europe mostly, Italy, France, Argentina, Israel, of course. We import many Israeli wines, and occasionally, thank God it hasn't happened to me too often, you get the stare, the look, you know, I go with my yarmulke wherever I go, or a baseball cap. I'm proud to be Jewish, but unfortunately, the last 10 years, you have to be a little more careful where you go, which hotels you're staying at. It's the the fact of life that's where we're living in, and we're the chosen nation. We have to be proud of it. And yeah, and I'm proud to be an Orthodox Jew. My suppliers are all non-Jewish wineries, big ones, small ones, France, Italy, Spain, Argentina, and they get to know us. And like my father always says, we're not only in the kiddush hayayin business, meaning making kiddush on wine, we're in the kiddush Hashem business. Sanctify Hashem's name. You're an Orthodox Jew, people look at you, people respect you. Better behave like a Jew. >> Can I ask you a funny question? Like you really focused on the wine business, so why do you have a restaurant? >> Great question. Cuz in California, it's it's the norm to have a tasting room, to have a little bites, to have some food with it. But, you know, we're a kosher company and when Jewish people want steaks, they don't want to just a little nibbling food. >> Finger food. >> Finger food. So, when we built the winery, the Herzog winery in California, we decided to build a restaurant, which has become, as you know, world-renowned, very famous. And again, talking about quality and thinking of beyond kosher, it has a top Zagat rating, you know, Tierra Sur is the name of the restaurant in the winery in Oxnard. Uh most of the customers coming there are not Jewish or not kosher. But again, that's part of being a kiddush hashem, that yes, you can have great kosher food, you can have great kosher wine, strictly kosher, and taste delicious. >> And you're not compromising. >> Nothing. Nothing. Well, many times I'm there and as a joke, you know, people I'm having dinner with will say, "No meat and dairy, right? And no cheeseburger, right? No milk in the coffee." Said, "Right." Or no milk in the ice cream. And then they'll have the ice cream with the dessert come out and it's pareve cuz it's it's a fleishig restaurant, a meat restaurant. And they can't believe the quality of the food. And they say, "How is it made?" And I say, "Guess what? The chef is not Jewish. The ingredients are kosher and it's made in a kosher way, so you can enjoy it." >> That's beautiful. Is Thinking back on 30 years, 40 years of your career, were there I mean, cuz now everything looks rosy or rosé and you look from the outside in like, "Wow, and they're glistening and glamorous." But were there moments in your professional history where things didn't follow the narrative and there was difficulties and challenges? And if yes, how did you deal with it? >> So, thank God, we didn't have too many bad days, sort of. But, in life, you know, you have a a bad meeting or a bad customer or supplier that just says no to you. And thank God, my father, who was a Holocaust survivor, smarter than me, older than me, of course, and I would always go to him and say, "Dad, you know, I had a bad day yesterday, a bad meeting." And he would always tell me, he said, "Nathan, part of life is full of challenges. Thank God you don't have too many challenges. So, if the few little challenges that you do have with a supplier or with a customer or with one of your partners, take it, run with it, get over with it, and and and move on and move on and move on. And uh he always used to tell me, you know, he survived the Holocaust. He was a little boy. He was 9 years old and uh he was in hiding by an aunt. You know, it's a whole long story. We can talk about that separately. Came to America with my grandparents, penniless, and worked very, very hard to build a company. He He used to tell me he barely had salary to cover his rent. I'm talking in the 1950s. And uh and Baruch Hashem, thank God, he worked hard and he built and he had challenging days and challenging weeks. And he was one of the one of the partners, uh my uncle and my uncles and my father who built the company to where it is today. And we're following in their footsteps, hopefully not embarrassing them, take it to the next level. But uh you face challenges, you deal with it, you discuss it with someone older than you, wiser than you, and you'll be successful. >> What do you look for when you're hiring somebody in your company? What's really valuable to you? >> Passion. I see when I interview people and and I see today even 10, 20 years later after I hire somebody, somebody who comes with It's hard to always you know, hit it. You know, gauge the passion, you know exactly how good he's going to be. But when a guy comes, he's prepared, he knows about our company, and there's there's there's there's there's a fire in his belly. He wants to be successful, whether it's in marketing, whether it's in sales. And we have, you know, a few hundred employees and and I can still see today those that care about the company, those that are passionate about the company, especially if you like wines, that's an added value. It doesn't have to be. I have some sales people are not the biggest wine mavens, but they're great sales people. Some in purchasing, some in marketing, some in logistics. But if you care about the company, then that that's that's a big difference. >> Do you just sell wine or do you sell other products also? >> Many. We have a big food company. You know, Gefen Foods, Kedem grape juice, big item, Manischewitz Foods. We have We have uh thousands of items in the in the food company as well as in the wine company. Still separate companies. >> That's kind of where I was going. Like your your fam- your father, your grandfather, eight generations, it was wine, right? >> Yes. >> Spirits. >> In in Europe, it was wine, spirits, and beer. >> I didn't know that. Fascinating. >> Yeah, we made beer also. Actually, I was in Verbó, the city where we come from, Slovakia, Verbova, and I found in the cellar of the mayor about 15 years ago two old bottles of Jacob Herzog um beer. I have it in my office, a green bottle engraved. So, so it's it's not fake news. It's It's real news. Herzog's been around for eight generations. >> So, my question is at what point in your family's um history did you all of a sudden decide, "Okay, let's focus on canned peas and the thousand other products that Gefen, which in Hebrew means grape >> vineyard >> vineyard, um sells to the broader Jewish community. What happened? Like and were you concerned that that would distract you? >> No. No. So, good question. We had Kedem grape juice for many many years. And in America, different than many other places in the world, um grape juice and wine are totally two separate distribution networks, groceries versus liquor stores. So, we were selling grape juice to many of the grocery stores, and the trucks were going there. So, they asked us, "Why don't you give us some more food stuffs?" And the first uh item that we had other than grape juice was Kedem gefilte fish. >> Mhm. I remember that. >> Which is >> Does it exist anymore? >> Yes. Yes. Yes. A lot of people buy gefilte fish today. It's mostly frozen, but in the jars, gefilte fish and some We produced the gefilte fish. Just have grape juice and gefilte fish and wine, three items. I'm talking in the '60s. >> How did you know how to make a gefilte fish? >> I guess my uncle >> He found a pot that he >> And he learned how to make a gefilte fish. And then we started importing, interestingly enough, from Israel a tea biscuit, Kedem tea biscuits. Still a huge item today. Huge item. >> It's in Walmart >> Walmart, Publix, Ralphs, ShopRite, all over the world, in Mexico, probably Costco, in Argentina and Israel. In Israel, you can get it. And so, one thing led to another, and then people came to us. The truck is there, we're delivering food stuffs. What about And there was a void in the market at the about 25 years ago, there was a void for a good branded food lines. Then we just we came up with the Gefen food line, and it's been very successful. And that's produced in factories all over the world. >> But you don't Your Your focus is on the wine, and someone else in the family is on that? >> I'm totally in charge of wine. My cousin, Mordy, is the CEO. My My son, Chaim Charles Herzog, is the president of the food company. >> If you had to reflect on the last 40 years, how did you balance your family, your children, your now your grandchildren and your career? I'm sure it with flying all over the world and constantly evolving, it takes a toll. >> It's interesting because one of the things I do regret and it's it's my wife's fault. You got to blame You got a Jewish wife, you got to blame the wife. I have a great wife, thank God, who let me travel. I was a young man with four, five little kids at home, and there would be weeks that I would travel from Monday morning till Thursday night or Friday morning. Building distributors or building supply relationships, just building the company. And I was literally running and running and running for years until thank God, I slowed down a little bit. More people took over and chipped in. Daily Talmud. So, I'm always There isn't a day that goes by, a little bit in the morning, more at night, that I don't do my Torah study. And that keeps me in check, keeps me in balance, and keeps me focused at my I'm a religious Jew. >> Can I ask you a personal question? I'm assuming at some point in your life, all of a sudden, you looked at your bank account and there was more money than you probably imagined you'd have. I'm sure with with with with the blessing of of affluence comes opportunities, but also certain pitfalls. Um what could you tell a young person who is slowly but surely starting to you know, increase their bottom line and make money? What advice could you give them to make sure that they don't fall and that they they they grow from the experience? >> Great question. Stay normal. Try to stay normal and level-headed. What I mean by that? We've all seen many young people, not only young, even older people who make a lot of money and spend more than they make cuz they don't even realize, they're not thinking of tomorrow. They're not saving. Put away money. I I know too many people who've made some money and built a beautiful house for 4 million, 5 million dollars and 5 years later, they they can't they default on their mortgage and and business turned and they're having issues. So, live a very normal life, comfortable life. You're not going to find no Lexus or Mercedes or Rolls-Royce in the Royal Wine parking lot. Maybe some of my workers. None of the family members drive luxury. We live comfortable. We give a lot of charity and we're we're careful. We live a normal life. We don't live luxury. We don't go crazy. We don't go private jets. Even though some of some of us would like to go I've I've been on a private jet with friends, but it's very easy to get carried away or I have an extra 3 million dollars laying around. I can spend it. The problem is you can spend it so quickly. But income he runs the world and many times things change, take a turn to the worst, economy goes down, stock market goes down and you're stuck. So, we're always my father and my grandfather my grandfather alav hashalom blessed memory, my father my uncles always taught us be humble, be normal, live a normal life, no matter how much money you have. You have more money, give more charity. >> When you were just starting your career in your 20s with two little kids and traveling in your station wagon to New Jersey was charity part of your life even at that point or it only came later? >> Always was. Always was. Smaller amounts, less involvement with organizations, but was always part of our life. Always part of our life. Give charity. Not only give charity, give time. I mean, I have a lot of crazy things I do. One of the things I do, I fly a lot. If I'm in business class, I'll I'll ask the flight attendant, "What's your name? Where do you live? What do you do?" And United, interestingly enough, they serve Herzog wines in in business class. Yeah, shout out to United Polaris. They have our wines. And my secretary knows every trip I come back, I have the name and address and many times they have business cards of the flight attendants who served me. And I send them a nice thank you note, Jewish or non-Jewish. Send them a nice thank you note and a bottle of wine. Thanks. Thanks for serving me. Because when they get together with their non-Jewish friends and someone starts cursing the Jew, I want them to remember, I had this Jewish guy on the plane. He was so nice to me. Sent me a bottle of wine with a thank you note. And you can't imagine how many thank you notes I get back from them. "Thank you for the wine. We appreciate it. Thank you so much." As a matter of fact, it happened to me more than once. And some of my other Herzog partners, our cousins, they're on the plane and they say, "What's your name?" "Herzog." "Oh, there's a wine guy here. He sent us wine to my house." Now, United has hundreds of thousands of flight attendants. But you got to live a life of Kiddush Hashem. >> And forget about the bottle of wine and everything. They serve thousands of people a week. And how many of them even look at them more than a second? They're just a commodity, but you make them feel valued and and you show your gratitude and you turn them into a person. That alone is something special. The wine's good. I mean, I'm sure everyone appreciates a good bottle of wine. But just making a person feel valued. Fantastic. Mr. Herzog, Nathan, this has been fantastic and wonderful. Um and thank you so much for coming all the way from Monsey to join us. And you should continue to have success, sell a lot of wine, bring a lot of happiness, and most importantly, keep uh doing the great things that you're doing for the Jewish people. >> Amen. Thank you. Thank you. Thank everybody. Le Chaim. Le Chaim. And enjoy great wines. Enjoy life and stay normal. >> Before we close, why not subscribe to Mentorship in a Moment. Every episode delivers access to the conversations you wish you could have with successful Jewish mentors sharing their hard-earned lessons, values, and advice to help the next generation build successful and meaningful lives. This podcast is part of the Olami Mentorship program which connects young Jewish professionals with experienced mentors for guidance on leadership, life, and Jewish identity. Whether you're looking for a mentor or ready to give back as a mentor, visit olamimentorship.org to get involved. Thanks for listening. See you next time.